Making Covid permanent?

[Clong83a]

More like 60-70% in El Paso now are refusing masks after we went through one of the worst outbreaks in the world while we had near 100% mask compliance. People understand now that a passing interaction at walmart is not where you're catching it. You catch it in places where you wouldn't be wearing a mask anyway, like at home or hanging out with friends, which is why the mask mandate had no impact here. Something like 90% of adults in El Paso county have had at least one dose of vaccine so I'm not sure what the point would be anyway.

Wow! I honestly haven’t seen someone maskless inside a building, including grocery stores, since…. July, I think was when the mask mandates came back.

Crazy bubble I live in, I suppose, but we have avoided the scale of outbreaks some surrounding areas have seen. Our biggest outbreak of the whole pandemic was predictably in the unvaccinated school system this last month. Apparently they were keeping the windows closed against advice, which kind of negates a lot of mask usage. Now they keep the windows open, even in the cold, and the kids eat outside every day unless it is rain/snowing.

 

[URedskin54]

Wow! I honestly haven’t seen someone maskless inside a building, including grocery stores, since…. July, I think was when the mask mandates came back.

Crazy bubble I live in, I suppose, but we have avoided the scale of outbreaks some surrounding areas have seen. Our biggest outbreak of the whole pandemic was predictably in the unvaccinated school system this last month. Apparently they were keeping the windows closed against advice, which kind of negates a lot of mask usage. Now they keep the windows open, even in the cold, and the kids eat outside every day unless it is rain/snowing.

You live in NM right? The impact vaccines have had on the Abq area vs the less vaccinated rural areas has been pretty striking, or at least appears to be to me.

 

[Clong83a]

You live in NM right?

Yeah, Los Alamos. And by ‘avoided the scale of the surrounding areas’, I mean even other areas of NM.

 

[URedskin54]

Yeah, Los Alamos. And by ‘avoided the scale of the surrounding areas’, I mean even other areas of NM.

Never been there. Is the lab and govt contractors basically the whole town?

 

[lawpoke87]

Very few people still wearing masks here in Tulsa….at least the places I go. Store employees…yes. Customers…no.

 

[Clong83a]

Never been there. Is the lab and govt contractors basically the whole town?

More or less a company town, yeah. It’s a beautiful area, though. Have friends from Colorado that prefer it down here. A lot quieter and the outdoor access is amazing.

 

[astonmartin708]

No one wearing masks around me… few are vaccinated. We’re having our worst outbreak since the pandemic began in terms of hospitalizations and I believe deaths as well.

 

[lawpoke87]

Covid is such a weird virus. This wave started in the south a few months ago. Has a 60 day cycle and then reduces itself down. Looks like the northern states are now seeing the wave. If it’s any consolation, it doesn’t appear masks or even vaccination rates have much impact on the actual spread. Hopefully, vaccinations remain effective against severe cases.

 

[watu05]

In Re-Analysis, Ivermectin Benefits Disappeared as Trial Quality Increased

When studies with a moderate or greater risk of bias were removed, survival benefit vanished

www.medpagetoday.com

 

[watu05]

I'm old enough to remember when AIDS/HIV was considered a crisis and the FDA was criticized for being too slow in approving a treatment. Various ineffective alternatives were being tried. It seems ironic now that the anti-vaxxers express their reluctance to the Covid vaccine because it was developed too fast. Even better that they need to do their own research.

 

[URedskin54]

Partisanship infects everything. Prior to the election there were many dems saying they wouldn't trust a "Trump vaccine." You'd still have some of the same people like Shon spouting their stuff, but if Trump had won the coalition of the anti-vaxxers would look quite a bit different.

 

[aTUfan]

our immigration laws are defined by the Constitution, yet the Biden administration refuses to enforce them and no one is punished for breaking the law.

but a law abiding citizen can lose his job because Comrad Biden said he had to get a shot.

 

[lawpoke87]

Santa Cruz county just mandated masks be worn in private homes regardless of vaccination status 😱. Never mind the lack of any evidence masks in such settings are remotely effective

Redirect Notice

www.google.com

 

[URedskin54]

Wearing masks in the home might really be the only way to make it an effective mitigation strategy, but where does a government get the authority to impose this and how do they enforce it?

 

[lawpoke87]

Dow down over 1000 points as I post due to a new Covid variant found in South Africa. This variant appears to be quite different than the others making the effectiveness of the current vaccines problematic. This has me concerned. I know I sound like a broken record but to everyone please get as healthy as you can. Eat right, exercise, lose weight if needed.

 

[GoldenCaneKC]

Wearing masks in the home might really be the only way to make it an effective mitigation strategy, but where does a government get the authority to impose this and how do they enforce it?

There’s no way I (along with millions and millions of other Americans) are doing that (due to a government mandate). Ever. If the government wants to preserve any level of trust, they should not even try to mandate/enforce something like that.

 

[watu05]

Agreed, although the root cause is huge a population of unvaccinated people, in this case in Africa, where the virus continues to mutate. Being healthy is a necessary but not sufficient preventive. Masks, social distancing, etc. are going to be necessary for some time. Political divisions on this issue will only extend the length of this war.

 

[lawpoke87]

Again…no evidence masks (other than n95) provide any significant protection against spread in a non clinical setting. Wish people would stop spreading info not supported by science.

Hypothesis is the latest mutation developed in an unhealthy host as it allows the virus to stay in the body a much longer time given more opportunities for mutation. Vaccinations are quickly not becoming immunity but a antibiotic against severe infection. The risk of this change is the greater likelihood of a vaccine resistant strain. The information coming out (it’s early) is that current vaccines may be ineffective against the new variant. Disagree with WATU, the best long term approach is good health. Especially with the uncertain of the effectiveness of vaccines on these new strains. (Not to say we shouldn’t be vaccinated). However, I have too many unhealthy vaccinated friends who are far too reliant on vaccines over good health.

 

[URedskin54]

Agreed, although the root cause is huge a population of unvaccinated people, in this case in Africa, where the virus continues to mutate. Being healthy is a necessary but not sufficient preventive. Masks, social distancing, etc. are going to be necessary for some time. Political divisions on this issue will only extend the length of this war.

Yeah you can have fun doing that in China. And crying about the unvaccinated is getting really old.

 

[lawpoke87]

Germany now has double the number of cases than at any time during the pandemic despite a vaccination rate of over 70%. Comes at a time when the CDC quietly changed their position to herd immunity is not going to eradicate this virus. Political division over there must be off the charts

Germany COVID - Coronavirus Statistics - Worldometer

Germany Coronavirus update with statistics and graphs: total and new cases, deaths per day, mortality and recovery rates, current active cases, recoveries, trends and timeline.

www.worldometers.info

 

[lawpoke87]

….and the Biden Admin just banned travel from South Africa less than an hour after Fauci made his statement. Jeez

 

[astonmartin708]

Germany now has double the number of cases than at any time during the pandemic despite a vaccination rate of over 70%. Comes at a time when the CDC quietly changed their position to herd immunity is not going to eradicate this virus. Political division over there must be off the charts

Germany COVID - Coronavirus Statistics - Worldometer

Germany Coronavirus update with statistics and graphs: total and new cases, deaths per day, mortality and recovery rates, current active cases, recoveries, trends and timeline.

www.worldometers.info

Germany still says that most of the cases are in their least vaccinated regions. It's also why Austria mandated Vaccines.

 

[lawpoke87]

Germany still says that most of the cases are in their least vaccinated regions. It's also why Austria mandated Vaccines.

That might be the case. If you want people to get vaccinated that has to be the company line regardless of the numbers. All that said, Germany still has twice the number of cases today than they had when practically no one was vaccinated. That my friend is alarming for all of us who want to see this pandemic come to an end. We’re not close

 

[TUMe]

Got my booster shot this past Monday. A few more side effects but nothing too bad. It was Pfizer. But this latest wave of mutation is supposed to be much worse. Fauci says no changes till we have more data. How will we get data? By a new surge in deaths. Some countries are shutting off people coming in. The talk is the US will do that this coming Monday. If true, some might try to get in this weekend.

Not to engage in gloom and doom, but lots of species have came and gone.

 

[URedskin54]

Got my booster shot this past Monday. A few more side effects but nothing too bad. It was Pfizer. But this latest wave of mutation is supposed to be much worse. Fauci says no changes till we have more data. How will we get data? By a new surge in deaths. Some countries are shutting off people coming in. The talk is the US will do that this coming Monday. If true, some might try to get in this weekend.

Not to engage in gloom and doom, but lots of species have came and gone.

I had the same experience with the booster. A little worse than the first time but not bad. Lasted about a day and a half.

We’re quickly approaching a point where politicians complaining about the unvaccinated will no longer be useful for them. Vaccines are become less and less effective at preventing infection and natural immunity is getting pretty high among the unvaccinated. Soon there won’t be many people that accept “blame the unvaccinated” when a politician puts in new restrictions.

 

[TUMe]

"This variant has a large number of mutations, some of which are concerning," the UN public health body said in a statement.
It said "the first known confirmed B.1.1.529 infection was from a specimen collected on 9 November".
The WHO said it would take a few weeks to understand the impact of the new variant, as scientists worked to determine how transmissible it was.

B.1.1.529 sounds even worse than Covid 19.

 

[TUMe]

BBC has a number of articles on this. 0400 mean time Sunday morning people coming into the UK from outside will be put in three categories. UK and Irish can enter as normal, others before 0400 may enter housing and isolate there, after 0400 new arivals must go to a hotel and isolate there and be subject to testing.

The US has Monday as the cutoff for 8 countries. This seems to be above even Fauci's pay grade, as it should be.

 

[watu05]

There’s no way I (along with millions and millions of other Americans) are doing that (due to a government mandate). Ever. If the government wants to preserve any level of trust, they should not even try to mandate/enforce something like that.

Here's the counter argument.

The only reason there are government mandates is that too many people are refusing to do their civic duty in a crisis. This pandemic has revealed how the concept of citizenship has devolved in to a one way track of people of insisting on their rights without understanding the societal obligations that go with it. Public health has always required people to make sacrifices to protect society as a whole. Back when quarantines were one of the only public health tools available, they required sacrifice if not active coercion. Compare today's resistance to the 50's when parents volunteered their kids as test subjects for the polio vaccine to today's anti-vaxxers who claim to know more about the vaccines than those who developed them and our public health officials.

If one chooses not be vaccinated, fine. But don't expect society that you choose to endanger to give you the all the benefits of those who fulfill their public duty.

 

[URedskin54]

Here's the counter argument.

The only reason there are government mandates is that too many people are refusing to do their civic duty in a crisis.

Yeah but that argument is dumb though. You’ve got mandates in 90%+ vaccinated cities

 

[GoldenCaneKC]

The only reason there are government mandates is that too many people are refusing to do their civic duty in a crisis. This pandemic has revealed how the concept of citizenship has devolved in to a one way track of people of insisting on their rights without understanding the societal obligations that go with it. Public health has always required people to make sacrifices to protect society as a whole. Back when quarantines were one of the only public health tools available, they required sacrifice if not active coercion. Compare today's resistance to the 50's when parents volunteered their kids as test subjects for the polio vaccine to today's anti-vaxxers who claim to know more about the vaccines than those who developed them and our public health officials.

If one chooses not be vaccinated, fine. But don't expect society that you choose to endanger to give you the all the benefits of those who fulfill their public duty.

Let me ask you a question… Are you currently masking up 100% of the time both in public and in your own private dwelling when you are around anyone else, including children and including when you are sleeping (if you’re sharing a bed with someone)?

If your answer to that is no, what would you say to someone who used the exact same logic you used above to argue that you are not doing YOUR civic duty, to question YOUR commitment to public health, and argue that government officials need to mandate YOUR private behavior as a result.

Basically, if you think mask mandates in private homes is such a good idea that the government should mandate it, why aren’t YOU doing it voluntarily already?

 

[TUMe]

WATU has a different view of the 1950s than I do. Lots of parents hesitated to have their children vacinated for Polio. The vaccine came on a sugar cube, which was easer to pitch than a shot. Schools required consent forms from the parent which not all parents would sign.

I am current on all Covid vaccinations and support their use, but lets not act like everyone was standing in line for polio vaccine.

 

[lawpoke87]

….and the polio vaccine…well…actually kept you from getting polio .

 

[lawpoke87]

 

[TUMe]

So...Fauci says we should wait for studies to be done before moving on the new actions. Mark this down, this is the first time I have agreed with the Biden Administration who one hour later announced they were closing the US border to people from the most effected area. Oh now Fauci says we should do everything possible to protect our people. Fauci needs to retire and get his own TV show.

 

[Gmoney4WW]

So...Fauci says we should wait for studies to be done before moving on the new actions. Mark this down, this is the first time I have agreed with the Biden Administration who one hour later announced they were closing the US border to people from the most effected area. Oh now Fauci says we should do everything possible to protect our people. Fauci needs to retire and get his own TV show.

It doesn't do a whole lot of good stopping travel. By the time they find a new variant in a country/region, that country has already traveled to much of the world 🌎 with some of those who are infected.

 

[lawpoke87]

It doesn't do a whole lot of good stopping travel. By the time they find a new variant in a country/region, that country has already traveled to much of the world 🌎 with some of those who are infected.

This….you might be slowing the rate of spread initially but as this virus has shown, there is zero you can do to ultimately prevent or even reduce the spread. The new variant is already in Europe and I’m sure it’s in the US as well. Eventually, all states will become infected and in the end to basically the same extent.

 

[watu05]

A point a Brown University professor of epidemiology made last on Friday's PBS News Hour. Said that a travel ban might delay it a couple of weeks, but that's the best it might do. Didn't see the value.

 

[URedskin54]

Thought it was amusing they skipped a letter in the variant naming so as not to offend the government responsible for the pandemic

 

[watu05]

Let me ask you a question… Are you currently masking up 100% of the time both in public and in your own private dwelling when you are around anyone else, including children and including when you are sleeping (if you’re sharing a bed with someone)?

If your answer to that is no, what would you say to someone who used the exact same logic you used above to argue that you are not doing YOUR civic duty, to question YOUR commitment to public health, and argue that government officials need to mandate YOUR private behavior as a result.

Basically, if you think mask mandates in private homes is such a good idea that the government should mandate it, why aren’t YOU doing it voluntarily already?

I'm sorry if you took it personally. I only presented the otherside which is out there.

But as for your question, yes, I always mask around unvaccinated people. Don't have any in my own home. We wear a mask when shopping, or around kids, and we haven't eaten indoors in a restaurant since the pandemic started. We've all had a booster shot. Compared to serving in the military (which I did), these are tiny obligations for a country of to ask of its citizens to fight off an enemy that has killed about 800K fellow Americans and isn't going away unless we all pitch in.

 

[URedskin54]

“yes, I always mask around unvaccinated people. Don't have any in my own home.”

Nice sleight of hand. Are we supposed to pretend that back when everyone was not vaccinated you were wearing a mask 100% of the time in your home? Because if you weren’t then you were contaminating everything for when other people do come in your home. A shame you didn’t do your part