I think they have mostly scholarship boys that were apart of TSA. I'm not sure about JM coaching license I think it may be up in the air. Having a league to play, Insurance and all the things that go into it seems like a stretch. JM can train kids. Gotta feed the families of the coaches and that money has to come from somewhere........
Youth soccer club
- Thread starter BasPlayr
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Most of the TSA boys are from the 2009 and 2010 birth years. TSA had very few boys in the birth years of the teams he’s trying to form. JM has an A Pro license as does Nsien. Remember…JM coached TSC’s 09 boys ECNL team to the ECNL finals a year ago. He can obviously coach. Not sure about the Admin stuff.
Correct...but they are trying to shut him down. I'm sure there is enough bad blood there.
TSA never took off the way Barry hoped. It was a good concept but they could never quite figure out what that looked like...and a lot of the older kids who want to play HS soccer leave TSA to go to an actual high school. I know a few kids that did this. We discussed sending my son to TSA but it 100% would not have been a good fit for him academically.
Nsien also holds a UEFA grade coaching credential, I can't remember if it's an A or B and my understanding is the UEFA coaching credentials are significantly more challenging than a USSF credential. And USSF is making it even more difficult for regular people to get advanced coaching licenses. I hold a C license because I got it when it was easier to obtain....go through the weekend of classes plus some online stuff, plus some eval work and testing. Now, I wouldn't be able to get a C license because I never played the game nor did I ever coach at a higher level while I held a D license. (Something about needing to coach a team that played in a regional league or national league for 2 consecutive years). I know USSF is trying to create more weight to its licensing process but you will discourage some coaches from even pursuing higher level licenses because of some of the experience requirements. I know a person who is a GREAT soccer coach, understands the game in a way deeper way than many coaches around here, but he doesn't hold a this license to get to the next license and then he'd have to find a job coaching an upper level team to get the next license, but he can't get a job in many of those programs because he doesn't have said license. It's this really wonky circular exclusion process. And why?
This thing should have been settled months ago imo but when the main parties to a lawsuit are both arrogant AND hate each other the only parties who benefit are typically the lawyers. I do feel sorry for those guys who guaranteed Barry’s note as they are paying attorneys simply because their were naive and made a bad decision by guaranteeing the debt. There is zero they can do to end this litigation.
Is it OK to assume that this is mainly a beef between Jim and Barry? I think Mark was ready to just be done with youth soccer in general and focusing on cornering the market for uniform and gear needs for the Tulsa soccer community in general. I think the only club he doesn't have right now doing their uni's through him is WSA.
Yeah it’s a tough….because on One hand Barry is a a$$ but if you pay someone over a million $$ and they sign a non compete they should honor it. So if the outcome is them both losing it’s probably fair.
I believe Barry thought they had ownership in FC Tulsa and filed the suit when FCT opened their academy. I may be proven wrong but given the lack of ownership and the latest position from the Feds banning non-competes, I don’t see a winning strategy for Barry here. There obviously could be facts which I’m not aware of which would change my opinion of the case.
FTC Announces Rule Banning Noncompetes
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Obviously there was a non-compete for Jim and Mark not starting their own club from the ground up after the sale. And Barry even bought into Tulsa Roughnecks/FC Tulsa early and had even started telling people inside TSC that TSC was becoming FC Tulsa's youth academy wing. Every decision for about a year and a half was based on that, even to the point where he mentioned a rebranding of the club and they went a 3rd year without new kits (almost all youth clubs are on a 2 yr kit cycle where they gouge you out of $350 for new kits). Barry was waiting for the Craft's to finalize their purchase and the rebranding because TSC's kits were going to basically mirror the USL kits, or at least so Barry thought. That obviously fell through. Jim joined FC Tulsa's front office and management staff and when FC Tulsa announced their own academy, obviously Barry felt Jim was behind it and a violation of the non-compete...but don't non-competes usually have a term limit?
What a mess and in the end it only hurts kids and the soccer community in Tulsa. Instead of having some great teams, you've got the talent so spread out you don't even have any good teams relative to National standings.
What a mess and in the end it only hurts kids and the soccer community in Tulsa. Instead of having some great teams, you've got the talent so spread out you don't even have any good teams relative to National standings.
Without FC Tulsa ownership and based on the new FTC ban on non compete enforcement it looks like a very difficult case to me. Again…unless there are facts which I’m not privy too.
…..and yes, non compete usually have specific term limits. Can’t imagine any scenario where the FTC would look favorably on an indefinite non compete. Barry probably never dreamed his main competition on the boys side come from JM and Nsien and not FCT….at least as of today
Yeah, but you are being paid for those non-competes. That is a key difference. Those guys were paid 2M for their troubles. It really is that simple.
Much of the FTC was the BS non-compete clauses that are dropped into contracts with zero remuneration and used to control employees as low as a friggin janitor and threaten them with litigation.
Tulsa will only be nationally competitive if there is one big club at an NL or MLS Next Level. I doubt kids will go for MLS Next if they are going to tell them not to play high school. Oklahoma kids won't know how to deal with that.
Tulsa is a very, very high school town. Ever since I moved back to this town, our newspaper has felt like a small-town high school paper. We have a beat writer for OU and OSU but not one for the Thunder. It is ridiculous. The Thunder are the biggest thing to ever happen to this state regarding sports, and we regularly run BS stories about Union and Bixby sports over them. We have the runner-up in the MVP and are in the second round of the playoffs, and the headline is about Mickey Mantle hitting his 500th home run on this day in 1967. Who cares.
Depends on whether a court believes the actions here violated the non-compete and whether the non-compete is valid. Reading Barry’s petition his claims seem centered around Instgram stuff. I don’t see a single reference to FC Tulsa or any violation of the non-compete through any association with FC Tulsa. Someone please correct me if I’m wrong here.
Just fyi…the non-compete referenced here expires 5-31-24 at the latest
Probably some sort of settlement in about 12-18 months when everyone gets tired of attorney fees and just want it over. Barry ends up paying roughly 80% of balance due. Attorney's win........
Sounds reasonable. For TSC’s sake this needs to go away as quickly as possible. ECNL is watching
It’s been an up and down season for my daughter’s team. They did manage to qualify for ECNL nationals next month in Seattle so there’s a positive there. Not expecting a lot from the team based on the current roster. Speaking of current roster, 9 field players were retained for next season. Playing at a huge Dallas club has its downside at time especially if the team doesn’t perform up to expectations. Making nationals is not expectations at FCD apparently. So many high level girls looking for better opportunities. Anyway….just sad seeing the faces of the girls who were relegated to RL.
Speaking of sad, TSC blackballed a 2011 girl ECNL player from the club yesterday because her 2013 brother went to train with JM’s new academy. She had been with TSC for years. Just another example of clubs and grown adults not giving a damn about these kids.
Speaking of sad, TSC blackballed a 2011 girl ECNL player from the club yesterday because her 2013 brother went to train with JM’s new academy. She had been with TSC for years. Just another example of clubs and grown adults not giving a damn about these kids.
Actually there’s not. 2013 brother went to play for JM. TSC decided it wanted nothing to do with the family anymore including the ECNL sister
TSC has been petty like that since Barry took over. You want to try out at a different club to see if it's a better fit? Better hope they take you. They care about you as long as you make them look good. Commit to an NAIA school even though you switched clubs....they'll pick up and repost it as though they got you there.
or she just wasn't good enough. they were total drama.
I hope what JM is selling works. Mike Nsien has connections like no coach ever has in Oklahoma.
MLS-next in Oklahoma is going to be a huge deal. I am not sure kids here understand how not to play high school, especially in Tulsa. Tulsa is a very high school town. In MLS-Next, you don't play high school soccer. That isn't just a club rule. That is a basic tenet of the league. That said they want people from outside of Tulsa to be training there.
They are going to get smashed on at first .
Barry didn’t demote her from ECNL. He kicked her out of the club. Zero about how good she is but retribution for her brother signing with JM.
I don’t think most parents and players in Oklahoma understand the level of play in MLS-next. I also don’t see a viable path to a local MLS-next academy in Tulsa without players from outside the area participating. There simply isn’t the talent pool locally. Who knows….if FC Tulsa gets behind there’s certainly a possibility. MLS-next Oklahoma would obviously hurt the local ECNL team if they’re still around.
100% agree. Even with the backing of FC Tulsa and Nsien the odds of an MLS-next academy in Tulsa is a long shot. Would obviously be great to see our elite kids be able to stay home but I simply don’t see it in the cards.
JM is the best technical coach in Tulsa. Nsien is a very good tactical coach so what they're teaching kids and how they're teaching it will absolutely make them better players and prep them for whatever level of soccer they want to play at.
Maybe, maybe not. All of these MLS clubs have satellites regionally. Doesn't make them MLS Next necessarily but if they find a place like Tulsa has the facilities and a pool of talent they can supplement with regional kids (think NW Arkansas, OKC, maybe even Wichita) they'll do it. The problem is the facility and there's not a ton of land out there that's not in the boonies to develop one. I suppose they could buy Mohawk from the city and develop it into something like Toyota down in Frisco and there's a lot of land on the east side of that complex where they could put a learning center and indoor locker rooms and training/S&C space.
But that's a pipe dream. Tulsa area clubs have been so about chasing $$$ that they've completely screwed over the talent pool they had and fractured what should have been a common vision of making Tulsa one of the hot beds for soccer in the US.
I foresee in the next 3 years someone (Crafts, Shubert, JSC etc. possibly oversees $$$) Comes in to make a play to consolidate. One problem with purchasing a club is what are you buying? Tents, flags and a name? Non competes will be no good. So many kids want to be able to say they are "Top team" that they would go to a new start up club so they can say they are a gold level player. Facilites in Tulsa Metro outside of Indian Springs and JSC are horrendous. Coaches move around as the wind blows. Parents think soccer is expensive (it's not).
Let's put Tulsa Metro Area Soccer Clubs in perspective rankings wise.
TSC Boys #68 Girls #109 Combined #68
WSA Boys #308 Girls #162 Combined #172
Blitz Boys #637 Girls #299 Combined #375
What consolidation makes sense?
WSA has volume a lot of weak coaches and sub-par fields, solid leadership
Blitz has good local coaches, terrible practice fields, game day at JSC will help, solid leadership
TSC has ECNL and solid coaches albeit mostly from Brazil and 2nd best complex. Horrible person as owner.
Let's put Tulsa Metro Area Soccer Clubs in perspective rankings wise.
TSC Boys #68 Girls #109 Combined #68
WSA Boys #308 Girls #162 Combined #172
Blitz Boys #637 Girls #299 Combined #375
What consolidation makes sense?
WSA has volume a lot of weak coaches and sub-par fields, solid leadership
Blitz has good local coaches, terrible practice fields, game day at JSC will help, solid leadership
TSC has ECNL and solid coaches albeit mostly from Brazil and 2nd best complex. Horrible person as owner.
You’re buying the platform if you’re acquiring TSC. Any potential purchaser better have a long talk with ECNL and get certain assurances in writing. With competent leadership that ECNL platform is extremely valuable. When Barry acquired TSC they were by far the largest competitive club in the Tulsa metro. That is no longer true. ECNL is the prize. As long as TSC has those letters there is zero reason why they aren’t the dominant club in this area….other than poor leadership.
I just saw that Jenks Sports Complex has entered into a naming rights agreement with Scheel's. This is great and hopefully it leads to more improvements out there. Taller fences/nets behind the fields on the west side, improved walkway access to the fields on the north end of the complex and further turf/irrigation improvements. If he can get those fields to a level greater than the grass fields at Indian Springs then he's going to have a ton of tournaments and bigger events wanting to come there, even more than Mohawk.
Maybe you should see if they want to hire you as a consultant?? It's right at a year and they have made great strides. It's not taxpayer funded like your Indian Springs (Only Titan and Scheels are privately funded in the State of Oklahoma). It's not a billionaire family like Titan. Just a couple guys trying to improve a facility not only from a field usage but also customer service to the clubs. Try to call and rent a field from Indian Springs.....Try to make a last minute change or need a field painted. There is a reason clubs are all wanting to use them and it's more than just field conditions. You like to post on here and TulsaSoccerguy but you're really not as informed as you think. You're a Blitz guy why don't you ask Robbie why they like them.
Blah, Blah whines about Alsuma constantly, and it gets washed out all the time. They could easily charge more and improve the fields. They don't so that is on them. You want good fields. You got to pay for them. Welcome to America.
The grass at scheels is incredible right now. A couple of spots here. Why is there this perception that BA is so friggin incredible? I have been to their fields plenty of times recently where they suck.
Lay off bro. I was a manager for a TSC team for many years and right when Titan opened the main and south complexes. My son had his arm gashed open by one of the fields at Titan South because there was literally no grass in the goal boxes and he was essentially diving on gravel. The fields that abut the west property line have the issue of the ball traveling over the fence and there's no access without jumping the fence to chase the $60 soccer balls...and then you're asking kids or their parents to walk through the tick infestation. A higher fence and/or a catch net would go a long way. The original builder did a poor job of walkways to the north side. Those fields are not accessible for anyone with mobility issues because the walk ways essentially end with the concessions/bathroom building. Have I said anything factually incorrect? My suggestions come from going out there for many many years and as a TSC parent, being promised the world as well as being told by TSC ownership that "playing and practicing on Oklahoma's premier soccer complex" cost a lot of money that the players/teams needed to pay for. At no point was Titan, either location, other than the turf field at main, ever the premier soccer complex in Oklahoma. JSC still isn't the premier complex...yet. With Scheel's in the mix, it definitely has the chance to become that. As many on here have discussed, I'm not sure the answer is making it all turf. Yes it allows games to continue to be played if it rains a bunch...but there is at least anecdotal evidence that soccer on turf leads to an increased incidence of knee injuries. Tulsa (and Oklahoma) need a premier grass soccer facility like Toyota in Dallas (or even the train yard complex in Plano...look it up, it is a great complex with fantastic fields).
And yes, BA is extremely stingy with non BA clubs coming in and using ISSC for regular league games. And I believe that Blitz has already said most of their league games will be out at Jenks. I hope that include OSA leagues because I am pretty much not going to referee any more games out at Haikey as my knees and ankles can't take the pot holes any more. I'm refereeing a bunch of games at Mohawk this week for National Cup regionals. We'll see what shape that complex is in. If the city of Tulsa cared about what type of numbers that complex could bring in, they would invest a little bit more into it as well. Instead, pretty much every local club is trying to use it as little as possible. Even TSC's tournament tried to shift most games to Jenks.
Interesting note on the owner of Scheels Sports Complex he designed and sold the only officially licensed University of Tulsa bowling ball. 24 balls were made. Only 2 remain undrilled. One in his office and one in Mike Case’s office who thought it was to nice to bowl with. His Grandfather also was in charge of the original Astro turf installed at TU. (Basically turf over concrete then).
Almost all the soccer complexes in Oklahoma use the ordinary Bermuda turf grass as the playing surface. Most of the complexes in Dallas use a hybrid which is cut very low providing a superior soccer pitch. Is there any chance Scheels could install a couple of these fields now they’ve purchase the naming rights? Also…is there a reason the Oklahoma complexes don’t use the hybrid turf? More maintenance ?
Which Scheel's complex are we talking? The one now in Jenks or the one in Kansas City? And I used to play flag football on the fuzzy concrete at Skelly. Tore my calf muscle trying to start a pass rush. That was pretty ****ing excruciating.
You've got to mow it and water it and do some weed control on them. TU uses the same tif-hybrid Bermuda Souther Hills uses in their fairways. It's hearty, pretty disease and drought resistant, and also has a thick enough root base to stand up to heavy play. TU waters the crap out of theirs though before and at half time of games don't played pretty soft.
If I recall correctly, it cost TU $90k to install that new grass at the track and soccer stadium. We donated some money towards the cause. And I don't have a clue what the annual maintenance budget of said turf is. At the same time if you're installing that out there, you're not allowing team practices 3 hrs a night 5 nights a week and then a full slate of games on Saturdays and Sundays. TUs practice pitch between the tennis facility and Bama is also a really nice surface. If Scheel's/Jenks SC could get that quality they'd be in business for best in OK.
The better fields in Dallas (Texans, FCD, Solar) all have turf which look a lot like that at TU. I assume it’s the same. The turf at FCD seems to hold up quite well. They both train and olay on the fields as well as host tournaments most weekends. Now they have 18 full size fields at Toyota so they can use them in rotations. Still…they look as good in September as they do in May. It’s just a great surface for soccer.
Bentgrass can be problematic as it will require frequent mowing, pest management, watering and fertilizing, especially in the summer months in the south. In cooler climes not so much maintenance.
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