So let's be clear...you are not considered "competitive" until 11 years old in the 9v9 games and then move to 11v11 at U13. Most clubs will have what they call a junior academy for the U10s and under to start developing kids for when they get to the "competitive" age groups. A lot of people will call it "competitive" because the club is a competitive club and hold tryouts and cut kids later on.Anyone familiar with the Sheffield United local club. They are looking to start a team for “2013 youth”. My son has been approached about his son signing up?
Should 6 year olds really be in a competitive club like Sheffield?
OSA has been a wreck since Kurt Lutweiller left for a coaching job in Georgia 3-4 years ago. And the tension between TSC and Blitz is sort of like LAFC vs :LA Galaxy or Portland Timbers vs Seattle Sounders (both great rivalry games played this past weekend). I know, as team managers, we've been strongly discouraged from playing in an Blitz associated tournament and we've been discouraged from scheduling scrimmages w/ Blitz/Energy teams. And now that Levi Coleman has left Blitz/Energy to start the Tulsa Athletic Academy, I suspect there will be a noticeable drop off in the number of players at Blitz/Energy, especially on the boys' side. With Bixby Highlanders and Sheffield joining OPC this Spring, Tornadoes may be the only OSA club left (although they hold dual membership as they also now fall under the WSA mantle). And by largest club in the state, are you referring to all components, east, west, and central?
There are some other good teams out there...South Lakes has a quality program and Norman (Celtic) has some very good teams, it's just hit or miss to if they have one in every age group. South Lakes is a pretty deep club too as they usually have 2-3 good teams (at least on the boys side) in most age groups.Yes...all components. I don't know much about other age groups other than girls 2010. Energy is projecting twelve 2010 girls teams this fall with four of those being out of Tulsa. Blitz/Energy is also discouraged from playing TSC teams. I think this is ludicrous, especially for the top team, as there are no other same age teams to play in the Tulsa area (for 2010 girls). The result is the top team from TSC and Blitz/Energy having to travel to play or find games against older teams. The top TSC team travels to Dallas on a regular basis while Blitz/Energy travels to OKC and Norman. It's frustrating.
There are some other good teams out there...South Lakes has a quality program and Norman (Celtic) has some very good teams, it's just hit or miss to if they have one in every age group. South Lakes is a pretty deep club too as they usually have 2-3 good teams (at least on the boys side) in most age groups.
I know Blitz was offered a seat at the OPC table...I know TSC asked them to merge and when they refused, TSC worked with MTSC and Tulsa United to merge the recreational leagues and unite under TSC...that cut some fields and feeder players out from under Blitz. It's been pretty contentious ever since.
We played in the Owasso small-sided last weekend. 4 games, 6v6, blistering heat. Right now the boys are training 2x per week. My son's coach also has an 03G team and has just gotten the 06 girls NPL team. They scrimmaged the 03G last week...the girls are bigger, faster, and better players right now...and a hell of a lot more physical. A few of the boys backed off and the girls knocked them on their a$$e$. They learned pretty quickly to play soccer against them. Right now my son is at the TU ID camp and he is one of 3 out of the 20 GKs there that isn't in HS yet. He had to adjust to pace and how hard they can kick and throw the ball. Also, Daniel Cherbonnier (TU's GK coach) doesn't treat him like he's a younger kid and is hammering shots at him. I saw my son do some things at the tail end of practice yesterday I've never seen him do in terms of reacting and getting up quickly for the 2nd shot. I am a firm believer kids get better by training with and playing against better players/teams. If they see how to do it right, they will figure it out and do the right things.Thanks for the info. All of that occurred before my time but it's nice to have some background on the animosity between the clubs. Our games with the South Lakes and Celtic clubs were rained out in the spring so I can't compare them to the likes of TSC, Edmond Soccer Club and NWOKC for 2010 girls. The Edmond and NWOKC clubs both have really strong top teams. We've been playing 3v3 all summer. Glad to see that winding down and some cooler weather soccer on the horizon.
We played in the Owasso small-sided last weekend. 4 games, 6v6, blistering heat. Right now the boys are training 2x per week. My son's coach also has an 03G team and has just gotten the 06 girls NPL team. They scrimmaged the 03G last week...the girls are bigger, faster, and better players right now...and a hell of a lot more physical. A few of the boys backed off and the girls knocked them on their a$$e$. They learned pretty quickly to play soccer against them. Right now my son is at the TU ID camp and he is one of 3 out of the 20 GKs there that isn't in HS yet. He had to adjust to pace and how hard they can kick and throw the ball. Also, Daniel Cherbonnier (TU's GK coach) doesn't treat him like he's a younger kid and is hammering shots at him. I saw my son do some things at the tail end of practice yesterday I've never seen him do in terms of reacting and getting up quickly for the 2nd shot. I am a firm believer kids get better by training with and playing against better players/teams. If they see how to do it right, they will figure it out and do the right things.
He's 13. He wants to be a pro keeper in EPL...but he also wants to be an engineer working with robots and AI. Oh, and he is a merit badge and project away from being an Eagle Scout, and he wants to play in Union's marching band. I say all that to say there's a lot of things he likes to do and right now we're lucky he hasn't had to make a choice or need to cut something out of his life because of scheduling but I'm pretty sure that day is coming within the next year. I really hope he finishes the Eagle off soon as there just won't be that stress of that. I don't think he realizes that with HS soccer and marching band, although they happen in different seasons, he probably can't do both.Congrats to him. I assume he's interested in playing beyond high school?
Girls are very rough. Part of that imo is they lack the ball skills of the higher level boys.
Guess my brag is that my daughter's 3v3 team is ranked second in the country out of more than 300 teams. We beat the last years national runner-up a few weeks ago. Cool to see a Tulsa area team rated that high. Our local soccer really is underrated imo. Nationals will be much cooler as they're in November.
Suburban soccer clubs are all complete frauds until U14. It’s essentially high priced day care that you actually attend as well.Anyone familiar with the Sheffield United local club. They are looking to start a team for “2013 youth”. My son has been approached about his son signing up?
Should 6 year olds really be in a competitive club like Sheffield?
OP?John Michael is my daughter’s private trainer. Great soccer guy. She’s become a very good player thanks in large part to him.
Did we scare OP off?
I don't agree with Huffy's stance on it. 6 might be a little early, but if you're not in one of the competitive clubs by 8 or 9 and know your kid wants to play soccer at the highest level, it's hard to get them through to the top teams as there is a lot of politics that come into play. Yes you pay the coaches in clubs like that but almost all of them have the appropriate USSF license to coach those ages and run appropriate age level practices/drills to develop them. I can say that the USSF D (youth) license process and course made me a much better coach and having a purposeful approach to every part of the game from technical and tactical training, to game warm-ups, to team development, to prepping and travelling to tournaments. At the rec level you get a lot of parents who used to play the game who may or may not know how to teach the game. We probably stuck with the rec soccer a year too long.Yes, I'm very aware of JM past issues. He's very open about them. He's cleaned up and has his life headed in the right direction. Anyone that teaches "English as a second language" in the TPS has my utmost respect.
OP....original poster. Haven't seen him back in the thread.
What's your take on Huffy's point that soccer academies are a fraud until age 14 and that a kid should simply play with friends in the backyard or by himself? I haven't been through the older ages yet to really have an opinion. My experience is baseball. In baseball, if a kid doesn't start competitive ball until 14 he stands very little chance of playing in high school from my experience. They simply can't catch up.
I bet the TSC coach offered a spot and a path to ECNL, which is part of the issue TSC has with retaining players and losing players. Kids who have busted their a$$e$ for TSC aren't even given a shot or a tryout for the top teams but a new kid is instantly placed and they may or may not be better than kids in the program already. And kids know. If they're given a fair tryout and shot, they know where they fallAll the TSC coaches know the top Blitz kids and vice versa. Calls are made all the time. Funny....I know a lot of the coaches at TSC. One offered and was working with my daughter this spring.
I bet the TSC coach offered a spot and a path to ECNL, which is part of the issue TSC has with retaining players and losing players. Kids who have busted their a$$e$ for TSC aren't even given a shot or a tryout for the top teams but a new kid is instantly placed and they may or may not be better than kids in the program already. And kids know. If they're given a fair tryout and shot, they know where they fall
And that's the way it should be. All of the clubs tell parents kids will be moved up or down based on their ability and what is best for their development and right there that's shenanigans. Rarely is that practiced.Yup. Offered a spot on the top team a couple of days after playing against them this spring. Blitz/Energy does the same thing btw. Our rosters came out today. Four teams. The only additions to the top team were two new girls. To be fair, my daughter joined from MTSC late last August and started on the lowest team. They moved her to the top team in a couple of months. However, she has been the only player to move.
I played rec soccer for ten years. I was never good enough to do anything more. But my mom volunteered to coach a team in west tulsa that couldn't find a coach, and that I was going to play for. I wish she had access to that training for a youth license!I can say that the USSF D (youth) license process and course made me a much better coach and having a purposeful approach to every part of the game from technical and tactical training, to game warm-ups, to team development, to prepping and travelling to tournaments. At the rec level you get a lot of parents who used to play the game who may or may not know how to teach the game. We probably stuck with the rec soccer a year too long.
It was an entire weekend, probably 24 hrs altogether in the classroom and on the field, plus an extra 4-5 hours of pre-class stuff that had to be turned in beforehand. "D" license essentially says you're qualified to teach the game for 8-12 year olds. Class "C" is the next step. There's at some out of class stuff plus 2 weekend. Most competitive clubs require the USSF National C license but some will waive that in lieu of other experience playing and coaching and then help you pay to get the license. I really just went so I could be a better coach for my son's rec team because I am someone who never played the game and I was pretty clueless. I learned a lot that weekend.I played rec soccer for ten years. I was never good enough to do anything more. But my mom volunteered to coach a team in west tulsa that couldn't find a coach, and that I was going to play for. I wish she had access to that training for a youth license!
She was just a soccer mom who volunteered to coach when nobody else would. I could have coached the team better than she did, and that's not saying much. What kind of time did it take you to get that youth license? My mom would have put 20 or 30 hours into it, anything more and she probably wouldn't have bothered.
My mom would have done that, wish she would've. I was around 15 at the time, she might not have gone to the class C, but even taking that class for 8-12 year olds would have put her light years beyond where she was. She wouldn't have had to worry about qualifications since she was only coaching a rec team that had no club qualifications. How much was the class?It was an entire weekend, probably 24 hrs altogether in the classroom and on the field, plus an extra 4-5 hours of pre-class stuff that had to be turned in beforehand. "D" license essentially says you're qualified to teach the game for 8-12 year olds. Class "C" is the next step. There's at some out of class stuff plus 2 weekend. Most competitive clubs require the USSF National C license but some will waive that in lieu of other experience playing and coaching and then help you pay to get the license. I really just went so I could be a better coach for my son's rec team because I am someone who never played the game and I was pretty clueless. I learned a lot that weekend.
I paid $50 for it and Broken Arrow Soccer Club reimbursed that cost when I received my license. The C, B, A cost more.My mom would have done that, wish she would've. I was around 15 at the time, she might not have gone to the class C, but even taking that class for 8-12 year olds would have put her light years beyond where she was. She wouldn't have had to worry about qualifications since she was only coaching a rec team that had no club qualifications. How much was the class?
Now I have ammo to give my mom grief. She could have spent the time and money for a D license without a doubt. Too bad we weren't aware of it. Do you have any idea if it was around in the early to mid 80's?I paid $50 for it and Broken Arrow Soccer Club reimbursed that cost when I received my license. The C, B, A cost more.
I don't know. I just know that BASC offered it to all of it's rec coaches when OSA brought the class to Tulsa.Now I have ammo to give my mom grief. She could have spent the time and money for a D license without a doubt. Too bad we weren't aware of it. Do you have any idea if it was around in the early to mid 80's?
Lawpoke, an update. TSC 06 girls just won a US Club Soccer national championship. And that team has been together for 3-4 years. My son's first TSC team would play that squad regularly in academy development. There is some merit for kids starting within the academy levels of private clubs.
But I do agree with Huffy that the whole pay for play deal is probably as much stifling for the development of players/the game as much as it also helps develop the players who are able to pay and play.
Lawpoke, your daughter’s team wouldn’t happen to be at the Roughnecks game tonight?
The slide tackle needs to be taught more by coaches. So many focus strictly on ball at the feet technical skill during practice. And if you know how to do it, it can be a very important skill. I'd settle for my son's team to just understand basic 1v1 defensive posture. Too many kids getting caught flat-footed then leaving my son in the precarious 1v1 as a GK.No....but I wish I was there. John Michael taught her how to slide tackle this am. Pretty funny watching her learn to slide.
The slide tackle needs to be taught more by coaches. So many focus strictly on ball at the feet technical skill during practice. And if you know how to do it, it can be a very important skill. I'd settle for my son's team to just understand basic 1v1 defensive posture. Too many kids getting caught flat-footed then leaving my son in the precarious 1v1 as a GK.
My son's coach mentioned to his team the other day a very simple principle that probably should have been covered in week 2 of practice last year. "When you attack, open up and be wide. We want to spread out when we have the ball. When you're defending, be more compact and push them wide. Play inside out on defense, stay more central." It's a simple principle and my son's team pretty much does the exact opposite most times.
My son got to be a ball boy for the Roughnecks game last night. There were a couple of younger teams, including a Blitz team that looked like 8-9 year old girls out there with their coach (Mike Moritz who used to coach the Union boys and I think he's now out at RSU). Believe he also coaches at Blitz/Energy. The Roughnecks are a special kind of bad right now and they have been since they released Bastides back in April for his racial slurs in a game. He was one of their MFs that made things go. I respect the Roughnecks for their decision because you don't want that stuff in the game, but it really has hampered the team a great deal in their attack as he was usually the facilitator through the MF.
That's a great question. His team is playing in the Titan preseason friendlies next weekend. I wouldn't expect anything else before Labor Day. His team doesn't usually do any tournaments until later. His coach has an 03G team as well and they're going to Plano for Labor Day. We'll probably get 3 games in OPC in and then head to Little Rock for the first weekend in October. If your coach is open to suggestions, the Capital City Cup in Little Rock is a top notch tournament. Great field complex in Burns Park, good parking, and the event is well-organized and communicated to teams. You also get a little different competition as there are always teams from Memphis, Mississippi, and Louisiana there. My son's team went 3 years ago and played a team from just outside of Memphis and it was as good a game between 10 & 11 year olds that I've seen.Mike coaches one of the 2009 Blitz girls teams. Guess they're Energy now. Solid guy and coach. His parents have been clients of mine for years.
When's your son's first game of the fall?
That's a great question. His team is playing in the Titan preseason friendlies next weekend. I wouldn't expect anything else before Labor Day. His team doesn't usually do any tournaments until later. His coach has an 03G team as well and they're going to Plano for Labor Day. We'll probably get 3 games in OPC in and then head to Little Rock for the first weekend in October. If your coach is open to suggestions, the Capital City Cup in Little Rock is a top notch tournament. Great field complex in Burns Park, good parking, and the event is well-organized and communicated to teams. You also get a little different competition as there are always teams from Memphis, Mississippi, and Louisiana there. My son's team went 3 years ago and played a team from just outside of Memphis and it was as good a game between 10 & 11 year olds that I've seen.
We seem to play the same teams over and over but only because those are the teams that want to play in the same bracket we do. We played a WSA side 5 times this last spring. 2X in league play, 2x in WSA tourney (bracket and finals), and again in State Cup.I will bring that tournament up. We are always looking for competitive teams to schedule. We went to Dallas and KC this spring as our out of state tourneys. We had Orlando scheduled but they moved tourney dates and it didn't work with our schedule. Playing the same teams (TSC, Edmond Soccer, NWOKC, etc..) again and again does get old.
We seem to play the same teams over and over but only because those are the teams that want to play in the same bracket we do. We played a WSA side 5 times this last spring. 2X in league play, 2x in WSA tourney (bracket and finals), and again in State Cup.
If your coaching knows what they are doing and you are playing the same teams again and again it’s a unique opportunity to develop the skills of your players to exploit the weaknesses of the other teams rather just trying to run, pass or muscle around the opposing side like most USA coaches want to do. This is why “professional” coaches in the USA are a joke. You should be looking forward to playing Edmond again, and your daughter facing number 11 again but this time she has the back cut down the wing to beat her she didn’t have last year or the combo you taught her last month has 11 tied in knots because she’s unbalanced to her weak side. That’s what youth soccer is about, not going to Orlando or winning 20 games
We do enjoy the competitive side. 9v9 was fun because that’s where you start seeing kids gain an understanding of space and understanding space is almost more important than being able to beat a 9 year old off the dribble. You also start to understand possession is important and sometimes going backwards is OK. The game starts to look like the way it is supposed to be played (for the most part).We seem to play the same teams over and over but only because those are the teams that want to play in the same bracket we do. We played a WSA side 5 times this last spring. 2X in league play, 2x in WSA tourney (bracket and finals), and again in State Cup.
We play the OKC area teams a lot. I will be in Edmond the next two weekends (regionals 3v3 and then a friendly) for instance and then go back on August 18th for the Beat the Heat tourney. Other than the top TSC team, the rest of the eastern Okla and western Arkansas 2010 girls teams aren't very competitive. Traveling to play friendlies is frustrating. We get to play up this fall (9v9) for tourneys under Energy. Looking forward to those games. Have you enjoyed competitive (9v9 and 11v11)?