Why are we incurring these substantially increased travel costs to play SJSU? Describing SJSU as mediocre is an undeserved compliment. If they beat us, its a public relations disaster. If we win, its so what? There are so many other teams close by in areas we recruit. Why not play them instead?
Why are we playing SJSU?
- Thread starter Tulsa Guy
- Start date
Because Gragg has zero networking skills so San Jose and Wyoming (mwc/wac) are all he can get besides answering the phone for buy games.
He has scheduled so poorly we are in trouble with few road games available to start a home and home series.
Need to call up Liberty, NM St, UMass, Army and BYU to start somethung with a home game and be able to juggle return games for a few years out so we can bring some balance into the games to get home and home series with better opponents. Maybe a buy game with a low level Sunbelt or CUSA may be necessary to turn it around or eating the bullet and two FCS teams in one year.
There are several middling regional P5 teams we should be trying to score home and homes with, Kansas being number 1, Baylor, Missouri, Colorado, Iowa St, Kansas St are all possible. Hell Arkansas went to Colorado St, first.
Couple that with a premier lower conference team like Boise, Troy, SDSU, UAB, Northern Illinois. Toss in regional opponents/hot recruiting areas like UTSA, Rice, UNT, Arkansas State, La Tech, Florida schools.
Finish off with two for one series/buy game
It’s very hard to get many takers for a home/home with the first game here then the return game 3 years later.
This one was scheduled back in 2014.
Oh? The academies have rarely sustained success for any period of time.
Who would you rather see on a home schedule? Considering the difficulty in scheduling P5's BYU and Army should be prime targets for fan interest, as well as the handful of top g5 teams. Otherwise the more regional the opponent and the more Texas teams in particular the better.
If Tulsa isn't good enough to compete at that level under Monty then Monty will have to go. We hardly face more recruiting restrictions then the Academies and should win 90% of our regional g5 programs.
Army sounds like a good idea, but if you have experience traveling with the team you know that the Army people treated us like garbage back during the TG/Gus era. Casual fan vs casual fan wasn’t a problem in the stands and it was a gorgeous campus, but there were significant problems with their professional staff and some over the top arrogance that rubbed some boosters the wrong way. No chance that deal ever gets signed. I’ve thought for years that BYU, Air Force and Wyoming should be on our schedule every third year even if we have to throw in a few no return basketball games to do the deal.
I’d like to see them try to sign a night game in Baton Rouge. Fun venue and atmosphere and we are recruiting again in LA, but not anybody they want. It’s a short flight. Lots of reasons that game makes sense.
If we were smart we would get our Provost to study all the FBS schools, have her figure out which ones aren’t going to be in business in 5 years like she claims half of them won’t be, and then sign 2-1 deals that are guaranteed money for all three games with the first game being the only game in Tulsa. By the time the two away games happen, they will be wrapping up their school, we get a check for doing nothing, and can add a last minute body bag game in Austin or wherever.
“if we were smart we would get our Provost to study all the FBS schools, have her figure out which ones aren’t going to be in business in 5 years like she claims half of them won’t be, and then sign 2-1 deals that are guaranteed money for all three games with the first game being the only game in Tulsa. By the time the two away games happen, they will be wrapping up their school, we get a check for doing nothing, and can add a last minute body bag game in Austin or wherever.”
Yes to this suggestion. One way to find out if the TU administration really believes their premise! ; )
Yes to this suggestion. One way to find out if the TU administration really believes their premise! ; )
...and the city is such a lovely place to visit, the whole town looks like a park.
Not against any of this. But a couple things. We've played Army what once? Twice in our history?
We cancelled our game around the same time with Texas Tech. Much like our staff the majority of people at Tech or Army are different 10+ years later.
Also just being honest I frankly don't care if some important people 10 years ago got some bad service. Tulsa is not in a position of pride at the moment. We are in a position of needing to schedule decent attractive teams, preferably with scheduling flexibility to deal with our own issues.
Swallow the pride and get on the phone.
Army cancelled the return game with us right after we beat them, leaving us scrambling for a last minute replacement. No thanks.
Again sounds familiar....Texas Tech.
A decade ago, I can go look but I doubt there is even one person the same in their athletic department. Never mind the whole OSU and Arkansas bs we put up with but seem ok with.
Time to get over it. Having a series with Army, BYU, Boise type name programs is going to need to be the basis of our ooc schedules. Add in a home game from a two for one deal, our solid conference home slate and you have a very solid attractive draw for casual fans.
Our pride from over ten years ago? Who cares. . . You think Joe who just moved down from KC even knows about that? But he's got some patriotism in him and likes to support local. The Tulsa World getting more excited about Wyoming or Army?
Come on people, ain't nobody got time for decade old bs. We need to attract more than 20k on a regular basis.
Teams likely to get at least name recognition and therefore some attention/come with some national draw.
BYU
Boise
Army
Air Force
Regional teams that may be close enough to travel, have possible alumni near by, or may be known to locals.
North Texas
Arkansas St
UTSA
Rice
La Tech
Colorado St
UAB
Southern Miss
This is the core of what should be our scheduling and is actually accomplishable with out contorting our schedule (lots of 2-1s) to make happen.
Mix in a series or two with P5 programs with the top bunch and you have six or seven good home ooc games over a ten year period. Mix in our occasional 2-1s with OU or OSU and have eight or nine good home draws for a decade.
Set up series with those regional teams preferably with two of the better teams on years with out a good national name opponent. Add in the FCS games as need for buy games or 2-1s.
So we could get ooc schedules that look like this
Year 1
Army
@Rice
@OU
FCS
Year 2
@OSU
Rice
@Buy game
UAB
Year 3
@UAB
Liberty
@OU
Texas State
Year 4
OSU
FCS
@Texas St
@Army
Year 5
@Buy game
@Boise
OU
FCS
Year 6
Boise
@OSU
@Liberty
FCS
FCS as season openers so we can easily control time (especially with it likely to be a plus broadcast), avoid OU and OSU conflicts and get people who are just ready for football to start. If we can link these years to our better conference schedules like this years rotations even better.
It's only two p5 opponents but Army and Boise are attractive, UAB and Rice make a decent pull on name recognition and no FCS game. Giving Tulsa five very good schedules out of six years.
People are not going to flood the gates to see Army, Rice, UTSA, Ark State , North Texas . Our only sell-out games will be OU and OSU .
There are enough prominent people with long memories that won’t let this happen. Texas Tech won’t work with us again and we won’t work with Army.
Sorry but bull....Texas Tech doesn't even remember this. No one from Tulsa is left in the athletics from then but media relations. No one is the same at Texas Tech or Army.
I won't even go in to how stupid that would be when it comes to making important business decisions or what that would say about those "important" people holding a grudge for eleven years over bad service, in front of the school.
American
2018 vs Cental Arkansas 18k (0-0)*
2017 vs Navy 21k (1-3)^
2016 vs Tulane 22k (4-2)
2016 vs SMU 20k (3-1)
2015 vs FAU 24k (0-0)
2015 vs #19 Navy 23k (5-5)
2015 vs #18 Memphis 20k (3-3)
2014 sell out vs OU? 29k (1-1)
2014 vs Texas St 21k, highest by 2k except OU (1-2)
C-USA
2013 vs UTSA 22k (2-4)
2013 vs Iowas St 20k (1-2)
2013 vs Rice 20k (1-3)
2012 vs Fresno 24k (1-1)
2012 vs Rice 22.5k (6-1)
2011 vs OSU 24.5 (1-1)
2011 vs UAB 22.5 (2-3)
2011 vs UNT 21k (1-3)
2011 vs Houston 29k (8-3)
2010 Tulane 23k (3-3)
2010 Central Arkansas 22k (1-2)
2010 vs Rice 19k (5-3)£
2009 sell out vs #6 Boise St 30k (4-1)
2009 vs Sam Houston 26k (2-1)°
2008 sell out vs New Mexico 30k (first HA Chapman game, 2-0)
2008 sell out vs UCF 30k (7-0)
2008 vs Rice 25k, 5k better than any game not sold out. (4-0)
°SMU drew 4k less (4-3) and #15 Houston drew 6k less (4-4)
£After Notre Dame win
^Houston had 19k, #22 Memphis had 17k
*No games over 20k, Cental Arkansas 1k better than UConn, SMU, and Arkansas St our next highest attended games. #22 USF had 16k.
Let not conflate our personal opinions with fact.
One time in the last 10 years has Rice not drawn 20k plus, in fact they have outdrawn several ranked teams we have had visit.
Our sell outs have been maybe one OU game, OSU didn't last game. I dont think either did the home game before mostly due to ticket prices.
Boise, UCF, and New Mexico sold out.
Central Arkansas brings people. Arkansas St was our second highest attended game last year. The first year with zero games over 20k since the early 2000s.
Using Navy as a sub in for Army those games would be regularly our first or second highest attended games each year.
OOC Texas schools draw well too, even the FCS ones.
Finally if we are moonshoting for sell outs in a year or two we are in trouble. If we are looking to increase local interest, build our ticket sales, and attract visiting team fans, we should sign up the schools I listed in my earlier post and conveniently bolded in this post.
I can’t speak for the Tech admin but I can assure you Tech boosters and alum haven’t forgotten....and won’t anytime soon. They will not be working with us anytime soon.
Alums, boosters, and records of contracts broken have no effect on current school administrations. When new coaches and AD's come in, it is a clean slate. Didn't you know that?
Sure guys whatever you say.......
Texas Tech doesn't give a damn, they don't think about us and don't care, I realize we are homer's on here but that's a big stretch even for a homer as far as how important we are over a game 10 almost 11 years ago. Hell most Texas Tech fans don't remember it and they were there for the whole thing. Most Tulsa fans barely remember and do so based on taking a game in Arkansas.
This isn’t as unusual as you would think.
We cancelled a game with Central Michigan on short notice several years ago and they couldn’t find a replacement game. Their fans still complain about it and hated that they got us in a bowl game a couple of years ago. At least we had Central Ark available when Army blew us off.
Texas State won’t play us again and Louisiana may not either, although we only pushed their return game out 9 years instead of cancelling.
Arkansas and Ole Miss are still squabbling over a game from 1960 and would never play again if they weren’t in the same conference now.
No one is going to work with a school that stood you up last time.
There are plenty of good opponents out there if the AD would get his job done, but Tech and Army aren’t one of them.
I’m not the one saying it. Tech boosters and alum are saying it. Most of us don’t understand the spot we put Tech in by the short notice cancellation.
Ok....again obviously people make million dollar decisions based in their feelings from a decade ago.....I am also always a fan of some vague people who somebody else on the internet happens to know.
Of course this all ignores the fact that our AD simply can not get us games and the further we go into his tenure the more clear it is he is not even attempting to or has the connections to try.
I named 12 other teams, at what point do we admit the guy in charge of making schedules is not even doing as good as Costal Carolina? Or San Jose St. Hell you could argue that New Mexico St and Liberty have better games
Vague people huh. I've been on this board a long time and I've never once talked out my ass. My wife is a Tech grad as is the rest of her family. Two of her uncles are prominent Tech boosters (god bless the black stuff in the ground). I know more about the inner workings at Tech then I do TU or OSU. The point is that influential people at Tech haven't forgotten. They have lots of other options for scheduling besides TU. I assume the day will come when our late notice cancellation is forgotten. That day is not today.
Agree about Gragg and scheduling. I expect it to get worse before it gets better. We are all about the $$ right now.
That decision was a terrible one for TU. Don't go to Lubbock and play a game that would have had a return so we can take some $$$ to have our asses kicked by Arkansas.
I believe they had less than 6 months notice but were able to find Eastern Washington as a replacement.
We found Sam Houston State as a replacement for the return game.
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No they don't. Rich people don't get rich or stay rich from making stupid decisions. A fool and his money soon part ways is a saying for a reason.
If this was Texas AnM and Texas I wouldn't even blink about it. We just don't count that much.
Not to mention if we go back and look in one of the scheduling threads this same conversation was had between the same people but then it was the Tech administration till I pointed out it was 10 years ago and nobody was the same.
Of course this little Tech detour ignores that I didn't list Texas Tech in any of the schools. We aren't Tech with a big 12 schedule who can hold grudges. Most importantly that the issue is our AD can not make a schedule worth a damn really either because he does not know what a good schedule for Tulsa is or he lacks the ability to get a good schedule.
https://tulsa.forums.rivals.com/threads/our-scheduling-is-a-joke.16914/#post-235610
I'm going to direct you to your own comment on this thread.
So clearly this sudden booster connection sounds just a bit fishy since you didn't bring it up then and tried to push the administration line.
But I agree with you on Gragg, but we're not even scheduling two buy games a year. We in fact aren't doing anything with our scheduling that seems to be a strategy or a plan.
Looking at the way things are done and how they come up it appears that Gragg is literally answering phone calls and signing up whoever wants to play us and caught him in the office.
I suspect this was the case with every buy game we have recently had except Arkansas, who he may have called. Word is getting around though that we'll do it. Meanwhile Colorado St and Coastal Carolina have home and homes with p5s.
I thought my comment was precise and very honest. "I can’t speak for the Tech admin but I can assure you Tech boosters and alum haven’t forgotten....and won’t anytime soon" As for the "sudden" Tech booster connection it's been there for over 15 years
. There just aren't many instances where we talk about Tech on this board. I've never understood why anyone (especially longtime posters) would risk their credibility by making up connections or sources. As for myself, the wife's family has a 6000 acre (more of less) ranch outside of Gayle Texas. Lots of deer, rattlesnakes, mesquite, oil and now windmills. I think it's about the ugliest place I've ever seen but they love it out there....go figure. The entire family meets there every Thanksgiving and other "special" occasions. In fact, I'm reviewing an oil lease for them as I type. Shoot me an email with your cell if you would like pics Better send the pics , he will need proof .I thought my comment was precise and very honest. "I can’t speak for the Tech admin but I can assure you Tech boosters and alum haven’t forgotten....and won’t anytime soon" As for the "sudden" Tech booster connection it's been there for over 15 years
I hope for better home games in OOC, but I knew when the stadium was downsized to 30K (actually 27,500), that was the end of the ability to attract good OOC teams that could bring 5-10K fans, except of course for our decision to play 1-4 OSU and 1-5 or 6 OU. I truly hate the OSU game whether here or there.
Seems like a lot of TU fans are now saying that they hate playing OSU.
Why has that game lost it luster for so many TU fans? It use to be a highly anticipated game. I know the last home game did not selI out, even before the weather problems developed.
I realize it is not the money maker it was when Skelly seated 35,000, but it still will draw a much better crowd than most home games, even though many of them are OSU fans.
For a lot of years, other than the occasional OU games, OSU was about the biggest fish TU played. I am wondering if it is because, fans have gotten accustomed to playing bigger fish than OSU, like Notre Dame, Ohio State, Texas, Michigan State etc.,
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Awww, the three amigos lol
Get together gentleman and work out the strategy.
Lawpoke, yes send me pics of some random lease to prove that your wife is related to big Tech donors.
You're a lawyer and this is the evidence you present?
Never mind that a family of boosters may be a big deal here at lil Tulsa but in Tech that's just one of many. Never mind boosters often don't get what they want.
Maybe you want to rethink that arguement for when you try it again in a few months when Texas Tech is randomly brought up?
Meanwhile let's talk about what I actually said and that you, money, and Luck are too busy high fiving each other to discuss. By the way Luck, I thought no one shows up for Rice? Money.....just lol at you trying to ride coattails.
With out using Tech (or Army if you prefer and for Blue) we are scheduling horrible and for no reason, there are much better options. Tulsa is about to be in serious scheduling trouble. Some teams have their ooc done until 2027, a few even further, some have one or two spots left open and Tulsa's schedule is pretty empty AND unattractive.
When you explain how scheduling a series with TU brings Tech more money than contracts with the likes of Houston, SMU, Colorado St, etc....none of whom have screwed them over on a football contract then I will be happy to talk about money. As far as evidence, most TU alums take other TU alums by their word absent a history of misrepresentations. Most of us are honest people who have better things to do than lie on a message board. You're coming across as an immature jerk when another poster disagrees with you. Hoping you're better than that.
"Bust a deal, Face the wheel" - Aunty Entity
I don't think anyone is arguing with you that our future non-conference schedule is very week, and we're probably going to get stuck with multiple FBS opponents to balance things out. That's all on the AD and the way he does business.
But we're not going get or give more chances to/from schools that have had broken contracts in the past. It just doesn't work that way.
the university has subsidized the athletic department greatly the past several years. With the new TV deal, perhaps our need to go get cash for playing big teams will be slightly diminshed????
I worry about @ mich st, then immediately @ SJSU. don't care how good those teams are, that is a tough turnaround...especially early in the school year.
I worry about @ mich st, then immediately @ SJSU. don't care how good those teams are, that is a tough turnaround...especially early in the school year.
I don't think the $ games are going away. Several on this board have speculated that TU will do the same thing in their budget development that the state of OK did in its funding of education when the lottery got instituted. While the influx of media money would be great, it won't matter if the university yanks 1/3 or more of its annual subsidy/budget allocation for athletics. Much like the impact of the lottery hasn't truly been felt on education because state legislators saw this new money as a way to pull money out of education and allocate elsewhere.
The SJSU game was scheduled back in 2014. We added the MSU game in 2017, and bumped a previously scheduled game at ULL from 2019 out to 2028.
A decision had to be made about moving either ULL or SJS out and we chose to leave San Jose as scheduled.
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