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Our scheduling is a joke...

TU4ever2

I.T.S. Position Coach
Sep 21, 2008
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Arkansas has now signed a home and home with Colorado St and BYU in both cases going to play at those schools first.

Tell me again how we can't schedule them at least 2-1?

Or why it's that Wyoming, Northern Illinois, Toledo, and Louisiana are the only home games we have scheduled ooc after 2019? Other teams in our conference have future schedules done but for few games till 2025 and we have a ton of spots open.

Frustrating.
 
Arkansas is never coming here. You’ll have to just deal with that. I think Broyles had it etched in stone before he left.

Most of the openings that we have coming up will have to be FCS opponents to balance out multiple road games.

I believe that cancelling out on Texas Tech a few years back has caused us more harm than we care to admit.
 
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Arkansas is never coming here. You’ll have to just deal with that. I think Broyles had it etched in stone before he left.

Most of the openings that we have coming up will have to be FCS opponents to balance out multiple road games.

I believe that cancelling out on Texas Tech a few years back has caused us more harm than we care to admit.

I think we have an athletic director who worries about money games and just fills in the rest with who ever calls us.

If it's fcs schools we will be in serious trouble as you are talking two or three a season.
 
If it's fcs schools we will be in serious trouble as you are talking two or three a season.

Well we only play 2 non-conference home games per year so I don't think you have to worry about 3 FCS games at once.

Between 2020 and 2023, we have 6 home openings and only 1 road opening. Most of those will probably be filled with FCS opponents as it is going to be very difficult to find quality opponents that will play here first then be willing to wait a few years for their return game.

We may even have a hard time attracting a Sun Belt team after we pushed our return game with ULL out 5 years (from 2019 to 2024). We also cancelled a return game with Texas State that was scheduled for this year. We're getting a bad reputation when it comes to honoring our commitments.
 
Well we only play 2 non-conference home games per year so I don't think you have to worry about 3 FCS games at once.

Between 2020 and 2023, we have 6 home openings and only 1 road opening. Most of those will probably be filled with FCS opponents as it is going to be very difficult to find quality opponents that will play here first then be willing to wait a few years for their return game.

We may even have a hard time attracting a Sun Belt team after we pushed our return game with ULL out 5 years (from 2019 to 2024). We also cancelled a return game with Texas State that was scheduled for this year. We're getting a bad reputation when it comes to honoring our commitments.

Arkansas just went to Colorado St and BYU first.

6 home opening in four years with no available away games is 2 fcs games one year at least.

We aren't trying. Period end of story. Gragg finds the biggest paycheck he can and signs home and homes with who ever happens to call us.

There is not a single conference school with that many home openings and such a poor schedule. None. We aren't trying. Our ad is a paperwork guy and an accountant with no connections, no ambition, and no idea.
 
It’s pretty clear it’s a zero revenue strategy.

TU knows what they need to make from money road games.

Then they try to negotiate over that number and take the excess and apply it to purchasing visitors to travel to TU.

Regional FCS teams are usually the only one that will come to TU for straight up cash at a price TU can pay and even they are starting to only show up on weekends when they don’t get better offers. Some won’t come at all because TU can’t bear the market rate.

If you wanna spend $1.5 million on a visiting guarantee, then that will get you the solid bottom third of most of the P5. However, at current economics, it won’t even get you an HBC “band” school like Grambling, Southern or Florida A&M.

Get used to the Central Arkansas visits. Get used to the fact that this is the one thing that Gragg can’t change.
 
Hard to pay even FCS teams to come play here when we're averaging less than 18k in the stands. Ticket revenue simply isn't there.
 
The AD at Colorado State and the former AD at Arkansas worked together at Michigan a few years back. That probably helped the Rams get that deal.
That's how we got Notre Dame on the schedule. Swarbrick was doing a favor for Bubba.

As for Gragg, while I don't think he's going out and seeking the right home and home series, I do think he's under some direction to take as many of the high paying sacrificial lamb road games as he can to help pay the bills.
 
It’s pretty clear it’s a zero revenue strategy.

TU knows what they need to make from money road games.

Then they try to negotiate over that number and take the excess and apply it to purchasing visitors to travel to TU.

Regional FCS teams are usually the only one that will come to TU for straight up cash at a price TU can pay and even they are starting to only show up on weekends when they don’t get better offers. Some won’t come at all because TU can’t bear the market rate.

If you wanna spend $1.5 million on a visiting guarantee, then that will get you the solid bottom third of most of the P5. However, at current economics, it won’t even get you an HBC “band” school like Grambling, Southern or Florida A&M.

Get used to the Central Arkansas visits. Get used to the fact that this is the one thing that Gragg can’t change.



First that won't work as a schedule for our conference or to get bowl eligible since this strategy leads to multiple fcs games a year and only one can count. Second that will only continue to kill our average attendance and drive down our ticket prices.



The AD at Colorado State and the former AD at Arkansas worked together at Michigan a few years back. That probably helped the Rams get that deal.



Oh so you mean their athletic director has connections he can use to get scheduling deals done? Funny how helpful that is. Gragg have any networking skills like that? No? Maybe we should have an AD who does? Or is personable enough to get it done when an opportunity is found? Perhaps he should be looking for opportunities?

Hell Army and BYU struggle to finish out schedules, we should probably try them, they even might wait for return games. In fact the Academies like playing us so toss in AFA as well.



Hard to pay even FCS teams to come play here when we're averaging less than 18k in the stands. Ticket revenue simply isn't there.

This is simply ******** of epic porportions if that is what they are floating as the reason.

Please see Nevada's schedule, UNLV's schedule, San Jose, or Tulane's. All average roughly the same number or less of fans.

Tulane has had GT, Wake, Duke, has a series signed with Northwestern, Kansas St, Iowa St, Army, Miss St., Southern Miss, and UAB

Nevada had Oregon St this year Cal and Purdue coming up.

UNLV has Cal, UCLA, Vanderbilt, Arizona St, Iowa St, BYU

San Jose has Army and Cal, they average 5k in actual people and BYU is trying to work out a series with them.


In fact every team in our conference except for Tulsa has a home and home with at least with a p5 and everyone other than SMU and Navy have two. Navy and SMU have both had two home and home series vs A5 since the formation of the conference in 2013 till now, both have their traditional rivalry game match up of course.

Just looking at the list it seems pretty obvious what teams are open to playing home and homes, they appear on the list multiple times. It's also pretty clear our AD is making zero attempts at scheduling. Even a blind squirrel finds a nut if they are looking for one, he isn't looking.


I apologize for tone which is frustration directed at our AD and the excuses I have heard from him, not fellow fans who have little control over this. This will kill the program though just as much as losing will.
 
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Hell Army and BYU struggle to finish out schedules, we should probably try them, they even might wait for return games. In fact the Academies like playing us so toss in AFA as well.

Army cancelled out on us the last time we had a game with them so I doubt they get another shot. AF and BYU are good options though.
 
I’m not positive but I think the Colorado State games came about because the pigs didn’t have a game after Michigan dropped them to play Notre Dame instead.
 
Army cancelled out on us the last time we had a game with them so I doubt they get another shot. AF and BYU are good options though.

We want Texas Tech to give us another shot? Give Army one. At worse they pay us to not play a game.

The schedule has to change.

We need to get a series with a Kansas, Iowa St, K-State, Vandy, Wake, Northwestern, Indiana, Rutgers, Duke, Georgia Tech, Colorado, Arizona St type.
 
Texas Tech isn't giving us another shot. We pulled out of their game at the last minute and they had to scramble to find another opponent. Ended up with Eastern Washington. They weren't happy to say the least. I have no idea is our cancellation is hampering us in scheduling other Big12 or P5 teams.

No clue why KU has such an aversion to playing here.
 
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Texas Tech isn't giving us another shot. We pulled out of their game at the last minute and they had to scramble to find another opponent. Ended up with Eastern Washington. They weren't happy to say the least. I have no idea is our cancellation is hampering us in scheduling other Big12 or P5 teams.

No clue why KU has such an aversion to playing here.


Nobody at either school in charge was there when it happened.

KU has come here before and just went to Coastal Carolina.

It's not that these people won't schedule us. We are not trying to schedule them. No other explanation fits.

Sunbelt/C-USA teams have better scheduling going on. We come with a tv package that probably gets them on when they play (see Arkie St this year) something most g4's don't get if someone schedules them instead of us.

We aren't trying.
 
Army cancelled out on us the last time we had a game with them so I doubt they get another shot. AF and BYU are good options though.
And that's stupid. If Army agrees to a home and home and play here first, we should take it. The academies always draw a large number of fans and I bet we would get a decent amount of people making the drive from Lawton (Ft. Sill) coming up to see the game. And there is nothing like a mid-October trip to the Hudson River Valley.

I loved our series with BYU and Boise after everyone ditched the WAC.
 
Texas Tech isn't giving us another shot. We pulled out of their game at the last minute and they had to scramble to find another opponent. Ended up with Eastern Washington. They weren't happy to say the least. I have no idea is our cancellation is hampering us in scheduling other Big12 or P5 teams.

No clue why KU has such an aversion to playing here.
Does anyone remember the reason we screwed Texas Tech? So we could take a big $ payday from Arkansas.
 
Nobody at either school in charge was there when it happened.

KU has come here before and just went to Coastal Carolina.

It's not that these people won't schedule us. We are not trying to schedule them. No other explanation fits.

Sunbelt/C-USA teams have better scheduling going on. We come with a tv package that probably gets them on when they play (see Arkie St this year) something most g4's don't get if someone schedules them instead of us.

We aren't trying.

Kirby Hocutt was most certainly the AD at Tech when we cancelled on them.

Yes....we cancelled the Tech game and replaced it with another loss at Arkansas. Was all about the $$. The sad thing is that we would have hosted a top 20 Tech team in Tulsa the next season.
 
Kirby Hocutt was most certainly the AD at Tech when we cancelled on them.

Yes....we cancelled the Tech game and replaced it with another loss at Arkansas. Was all about the $$. The sad thing is that we would have hosted a top 20 Tech team in Tulsa the next season.


Umm, no, no he wasn't. That was a decade ago. Kirby was at Ohio in 2008.

That would have been a chance for TU to make some real noise against a team that finished #12 in 2008 Texas Tech. We would have got another top 25 team at home in 2009 tech. Boise was top 10 and Houston top 15.
 
Damn...You're correct. Can't believe it's been ten years.

I'm not just saying this stuff, I looked deep in to it. I just kept being like no that can't be right every time.

We quite literally are not trying to schedule. It is getting to a program threatening level.
 
I'm not just saying this stuff, I looked deep in to it. I just kept being like no that can't be right every time.

We quite literally are not trying to schedule. It is getting to a program threatening level.

I doubt if there's anyone on this board who can answer that question. A better question is probably "What is our current scheduling model?"
 
I doubt if there's anyone on this board who can answer that question. A better question is probably "What is our current scheduling model?"

No we can. Go look at how empty our schedule is. You can't have a model when you don't have anything.

The current conference demand is two A5 opponents, preferably one at home every year for tv purposes. One every other year and an attractive g5 match up at home every year if not.
 
We want Texas Tech to give us another shot? Give Army one. At worse they pay us to not play a game.

The schedule has to change.

We need to get a series with a Kansas, Iowa St, K-State, Vandy, Wake, Northwestern, Indiana, Rutgers, Duke, Georgia Tech, Colorado, Arizona St type.


I understand your frustration, but scheduling is a two way street. Each school must look out for their best interests.

All of those teams you mention are P5 teams. So naturally scheduling a series with those teams would benefit TU greatly. Getting to play a P5 program at Tulsa against bigger name teams, that TU has a chance of beating. As they say, everything to gain and nothing to lose. Plus those teams would certainly help with TU's attendance problems, especially the Big12 teams. (Big12 teams already play two teams in the state every year, so there is not much if any benefit for them to play a third team) Not only would they bring their fans, but TU fans would turn out just to see bigger name teams play at Chapman stadium. All great for TU.

However, why should those teams schedule TU? What is their benefit over scheduling other P5 teams and some G5 teams. How many fans would TU take to their stadium and how many of their fans would be excited to see TU play at their stadium? A coach at those P5 schools would likely have difficulty convincing their fans and maybe their team to take TU seriously. Conversely they would have more to lose and not as much to gain when playing the smallest school in FBS.

So scheduling is more than just the TU AD trying, by calling up these schools and saying, we want to schedule a series of games. The other schools must see a benefit for them that is greater than any other scheduling candidates provide.
 
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I understand your frustration, but scheduling is a two way street. Each school must look out for their best interests.

All of those teams you mention are P5 teams. So naturally scheduling a series with those teams would benefit TU greatly. Getting to play a P5 program at Tulsa against bigger name teams, that TU has a chance of beating. As they say, everything to gain and nothing to lose. Plus those teams would certainly help with TU's attendance problems, especially the Big12 teams. (Big12 teams already play two teams in the state every year, so there is not much if any benefit for them to play a third team) Not only would they bring their fans, but TU fans would turn out just to see bigger name teams play at Chapman stadium. All great for TU.

However, why should those teams schedule TU? What is their benefit over scheduling other P5 teams and some G5 teams. How many fans would TU take to their stadium and how many of their fans would be excited to see TU play at their stadium? A coach at those P5 schools would likely have difficulty convincing their fans and maybe their team to take TU seriously. Conversely they would have more to lose and not as much to gain when playing the smallest school in FBS.

So scheduling is more than just the TU AD trying, by calling up these schools and saying, we want to schedule a series of games. The other schools must see a benefit for them that is greater than any other scheduling candidates provide.

That's all great. But explain why it's just us?

I listed a ton of schools in worse positions.

Why is Arkansas going 1 for 1 with CSU (who will bring no one and has terrible attendance) and BYU? Iowa St and Nevada?

The truth is we aren't trying period. Our AD signs money games and hopes people call us for home and homes. That's why we have Wyoming, Louisiana, etc. And nothing else.
 
NT and LT would require return games and we don’t have many of those to give out anytime soon.

Then that is even worse scheduling and we can drop football now.

Or maybe the truth is we need to fire our AD whose only skill and ability is doing paper work. Awful, terrible job.
 
Then that is even worse scheduling and we can drop football now.

Or maybe the truth is we need to fire our AD whose only skill and ability is doing paper work. Awful, terrible job.

Ok, you play AD. We’ve got home openings in 2020, 2021 (2), 2022, 2023(2) & 2024(2). We’ve got road openings in 2023 & 2024.

What’s your plan?
 
An 8-2 deal with whoever. We'll have to play them multiple times a couple seasons, but I'll make it work. I'd like my multi-million dollar salary now please.
 
Ok, you play AD. We’ve got home openings in 2020, 2021 (2), 2022, 2023(2) & 2024(2). We’ve got road openings in 2023 & 2024.

What’s your plan?

Have a feeling we’re about to schedule a lot of FCS home games. I do think it’s fair to call out Gragg for getting us in this scheduling mess.
 
Ok, you play AD. We’ve got home openings in 2020, 2021 (2), 2022, 2023(2) & 2024(2). We’ve got road openings in 2023 & 2024.

What’s your plan?

My plan would be to make the schedule out years ahead of time and not set this disaster up. Or an I incorrect that Gragg has been AD for multiple years? So we should let this continue because he has done such a bad job it doesn't matter anymore?

First to get us out of this I would sign deals with NM St and Liberty because they are currently in scramble mode just to fill games and can't be picky about when they get returns or even insuring they have 6 home games. I would also talk to UMass for the same reasons although they aren't as desperate. I would push their return games to 2025 and 2026. Use the two road games we have available to sign home and homes with Texas schools like UNT, UTSA, Rice, Texas St. while seeing if we can get any here first. I would also strongly consider La Tech, Southern Miss, UAB or Marshall and see if I could work out any with Tulsa hosting first and returning the game. That's 8 teams to try and get one from first and two away games that are regional, recruiting grounds rich, and names the casual fan might know. The Texas schools in particular might have fans or alums in the area for a visiting crowd.

Taking advantage of the Independents to push off games will help rebalance the schedule. We can look into trying to get BYU and Army but they are much more capable of getting opponents and less likely to work with us.

Several of those schools are former conference mates and many relish opportunities to knock off the schools that left cusa. The sunbelt teams are looking to improve their reputation so they will also desire the match ups allowing us to have a bit more negotiating room.

I would also call every single p5 program that has opennings and any history or connection to Tulsa (Illinois, Iowa St, Tx Tech) and see if we could get any home and home even if it is far down the road.

Toss in one fcs area team for a game and you might be able to have decent schedules our conference won't be on our behind about, that we can win, that with our conference home games might be attractive to casuals, that are regional and recruiting focused.

Or we can just keep digging the hole deeper. Of course this requires at the very least an active AD, preferably a salesman type. We seem badly short on those sorts.
 
The Liberty game makes sense. Half of the city of Tulsa has taken an online Bible class from them.
 
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The Liberty game makes sense. Half of the city of Tulsa has taken an online Bible class from them.


There are lots of things that make sense. We aren't doing any of them.

That's what worries me, there is clearly no strategy. There is also no future planning going on. The further we continue with this kind of scheduling the harder it will be to climb out of. We are already dangerously close to two fcs games in a couple years.

Army is trying to actively avoid that scenario filling 10 games each year. Even Liberty is desperate to not have that sort of schedule and they just were fcs.

Those games also drag on the tv inventory for the conference. I could quickly imagine a situation where our media pay out is cut because we aren't pulling weight since the conference controls rights to home games.
 
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