University Rankings

[JesseTU]

The US News rankings came out...

The University of Tulsa is tied for 106th (49 points/100).
https://www.usnews.com/best-colleges/university-of-tulsa-3185

2016 we had a release about 14 years as a top 100 school, at #86:

September 20, 2016
The University of Tulsa once again celebrates its distinction among American research universities in the 2017 U.S. News & World Report rankings released Tuesday.

TU is No. 86 among national universities, according to the publication, which evaluates doctoral degree-granting institutions based on several key factors including peer assessment, high school counselor assessment and class sizes.

For 14 years, TU has been a Top 100 research university and remains the highest ranked college in the state.

https://admission.utulsa.edu/tu-named-top-100-university-u-s-news-world-report/

Anyone know what slipped, or did others improve more?

 

[Gold*]

Might it be the mess with the education program?

 

[lawpoke87]

OU and OSU also dropped around 20 spots. No idea what's going on.

 

[TUBballJunkie]

I don't recall us being tied with SLU before, seemed they were ahead but I can't find older lists.

 

[TU_BLA]

There are so many factors that go into those scores and rankings. When I worked at TU we would get the score breakdown sheet. The points we used to get hammered on were the % of alumni and amount of alumni giving. With the smaller base the % was really puzzling. Amount was not surprising. I think endowment $ was on there as well and that would make sense as to why OU/OSU/TU might be faltering a little right now with endowments tied to oil markets. The usual factors like % of new admits in top 10%, cumulative GPA of incoming FR, % of applicants accepted, etc. are all included as well. TU was at its highest when it really pushed undergrad research and competitive national scholarships. They haven't stopped those programs but I don't think TU is investing nearly as much as they used to in them. I would say that next year's rankings go up a little depending on their FR to SO retention rate going into Fall.

 

[TU_BLA]

Might it be the mess with the education program?

And that and the loss of accreditation by the HLC (seems with the transition from Stead Up to Clancy, whoever was in charge of making sure TU had its crap together for their 10 year accreditation visit dropped the ball (I heard this from a high level administrator). While most of it was a simple housekeeping issue, not being ready for an HLC site visit is a big deal to that group. My guess is TU will likely have to do a 5 year well-check with HLC instead of the normal 10 year cycle.

 

[Gold*]

I heard something similar too. I think there has been a lot of re-shuffling and not all of it made any sense. I noticed the school is also looking for a new general counsel and the ad was unusually specific. I think we may have run into some buzzsaws, not all of which could be avoided: shaky local economy, downturn in people who can afford to go to the school, and random idiots doing idiot things, like that Moran who ran for governor and can’t get over that his husband violated school policy and got in trouble (they sued the school and bought billboards and Facebook ads). You can’t avoid all that crap.

Oddly, the law school is doing extremely well. It makes no sense. I don’t think the faculty is as strong when it was struggling.

 

[TUBballJunkie]

According to US News, the weight of student excellence and expert opinion was reduced while grad rates and social mobility (evaluated with Pell Grant data) was increased:

https://www.usnews.com/education/best-colleges/articles/how-us-news-calculated-the-rankings

 

[goldenhurricane2]

I heard something similar too. I think there has been a lot of re-shuffling and not all of it made any sense. I noticed the school is also looking for a new general counsel and the ad was unusually specific. I think we may have run into some buzzsaws, not all of which could be avoided: shaky local economy, downturn in people who can afford to go to the school, and random idiots doing idiot things, like that Moran who ran for governor and can’t get over that his husband violated school policy and got in trouble (they sued the school and bought billboards and Facebook ads). You can’t avoid all that crap.

Oddly, the law school is doing extremely well. It makes no sense. I don’t think the faculty is as strong when it was struggling.

That guy is one of the biggest wastes of oxygen on the planet. He’s said some horrible things about many upstanding individuals at TU... all of which are completely false. He may be the most butthurt person of all time.

 

[lawpoke87]

Help me out here as someone who received a Pell Grant. Once you hit the classroom there is no distinction as to how much money one's parents' earn. In fact, it is doubtful if the professors have any clue. Yet, a school is going to receive a higher ranking as to academic excellence if those receiving these grants perform better than the rest of the student body. We're not rewarding the school for retaining students with lower admission qualifications but solely based on mom and dad's tax return bottom line.

 

[TU_BLA]

That guy is one of the biggest wastes of oxygen on the planet. He’s said some horrible things about many upstanding individuals at TU... all of which are completely false. He may be the most butthurt person of all time.

Who are we talking about a moron or Moran? Guess I missed that episode of the TU soap opera.

 

[goldenhurricane2]

Who are we talking about a moron or Moran? Guess I missed that episode of the TU soap opera.

I don’t even want to put his name out there because he doesn’t deserve anymore attention, but it’s that psychopath who is trying to sue TU and TCC over some trivial bs.

 

[TU_BLA]

Help me out here as someone who received a Pell Grant. Once you hit the classroom there is no distinction as to how much money one's parents' earn. In fact, it is doubtful if the professors have any clue. Yet, a school is going to receive a higher ranking as to academic excellence if those receiving these grants perform better than the rest of the student body. We're not rewarding the school for retaining students with lower admission qualifications but solely based on mom and dad's tax return bottom line.

They're trying to quantify the value of a degree beyond did the student find employment or acceptance into a grad program within 3 months of graduating. It's dangerous to try and quantify that because those standards would hammer TU (and any other school in OK) if an elementary ed student got a teaching job out of college at OK's avg starting salary for an elementary school teacher. It doesn't actually measure whether or not the university did the job you asked it to which was to prepare you for life and finding the job you are seeking.

 

[lawpoke87]

How is my degree as someone who received a PG more valuable than my roommate who didn't receive one? Am I misreading the criteria? I read it as singling out PG recipients and giving a school bonuses (extra points) for graduating those individuals over non recipients. Is this intended to force colleges to single out their PG students and provide them extra support and services?

 

[TU_BLA]

How is my degree as someone who received a PG more valuable than my roommate who didn't receive one? Am I misreading the criteria? I read it as singling out PG recipients and giving a school bonuses (extra points) for graduating those individuals over non recipients. Is this intended to force colleges to single out their PG students and provide them extra support and services?

I believe they are trying to quantify the value of the degree...how much higher of a salary is this person receiving out of school than what he would have made had he stayed within the economic class he/she came from? It's a crappy way of measuring if a university is doing the job they claim to do.

 

[TUBballJunkie]

Zero issue with some weight being taken away from what academics think of themselves and their peers and shifting it to a means to quantify social and economic mobility, which should be a university mission.

Clancy is all over the things that are receiving more attention.

 

[TUBballJunkie]

According to NPR, "The gap between Pell and non-Pell students is also pretty astounding: Nationally, Pell students graduate at a rate of 18 percentage points less than their peers, 49 percent vs. 67 percent."

So yes, schools should focus energy on it.

That's a lot of wasted tax dollars if you're someone to get mad about that angle, too.

 

[lawpoke87]

According to NPR, "The gap between Pell and non-Pell students is also pretty astounding: Nationally, Pell students graduate at a rate of 18 percentage points less than their peers, 49 percent vs. 67 percent."

So yes, schools should focus energy on it.

That's a lot of wasted tax dollars if you're someone to get mad about that angle, too.

So are schools singling out Pell students and providing them academic support which isn't available to the rest of the student body? I received nada but that was a very very long time ago.

 

[Gold*]

So are schools singling out Pell students and providing them academic support which isn't available to the rest of the student body? I received nada but that was a very very long time ago.

When I was in law school, they had a program where the “at risk” students got to take contracts the summer before, then had a special study class instead the first semester where they got practice tests and outlines no one else could see. Some of them did well. In the end it evened out, but I remember thinking they was kind of crappy for the people who worked hard before law school.

 

[Gold*]

I don’t even want to put his name out there because he doesn’t deserve anymore attention, but it’s that psychopath who is trying to sue TU and TCC over some trivial bs.

Lolz. They will get theirs. They ended up suing the attorneys who were representing TU. That’s not smart.

Their attorney in that case is a moran’s moran. He somehow got the case where the Claremore sheriff bullied the hippy. I would have even taken that one. Sad.

 

[URedskin54]

Sort of nuts that the Law School dropped to #101 too. Didn't TU just have like a 95% bar passage rate this last year?

 

[lawpoke87]

Sort of nuts that the Law School dropped to #101 too. Didn't TU just have like a 95% bar passage rate this last year?

80% on the July exam.

 

[URedskin54]

80% on the July exam.

Ah I was thinking of last year. Still dropped 4 spots after hitting like 97% though for some reason. Obviously I don't know enough about whatever their formula is.