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Tulane and ECU announce home and homes

TU4ever2

I.T.S. Position Coach
Sep 21, 2008
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Tulane with Iowa St.

ECU with NC State.

What are we doing? Our last home and home vs an A5 team was signed and finished in the BCS era.

We have had Ark St., Louisiana, New Mexico, and Toledo lately. Wyoming next year. Half of those aren't even regional schools to draw home fans or local interest much less visiting fans.

What are we doing? The stadium size is an issue but it isn't a black hole. What are we doing?

We have conference teams with schedules basically set till 2027. Tulsa is way behind and most of the games we do have scheduled are buy.

What are we doing??????????????
 
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Tulane with Iowa St.

ECU with NC State.

What are we doing? Our last home and home vs an A5 team was signed and finished in the BCS era.

We have had Ark St., Louisiana, New Mexico, and Toledo lately. Wyoming next year. Half of those aren't even regional schools to draw home fans or local interest much less visiting fans.

What are we doing? The stadium size is an issue but it isn't a black hole. What are we doing?

We have conference teams with schedules basically set till 2027. Tulsa is way behind and most of the games we do have scheduled are buy.

What are we doing??????????????
I like the Wyoming game. They have a decent program. Much better than Louisiana or New Mexico in recent years. That doesn't excuse not getting the occasional P5. We need to schedule two 2-1 series. Starting one of the series a year before the other. That way, you would have 1 home P5 game every season 3/4 years after the first year.

Also, ECU has a state congress that mandates that they get home and homes with North Carolina Schools.
 
Okie State next year, right? They may be a decent draw.
 
If stadium size was an issue of any import, Tulane would not be getting home and homes when we are not.
Yeah, Tulane's stadium is, at best, only marginally larger than Chapman. When they showed the game against Memphis last week, I didn't realize how small the visitor's side bleachers were. It reminded me of the new stadiums you are seeing in MLS minus the weather canopies. And reminder- Ford Stadium at SMU has a listed capacity of 32,000.

I believe a large part of our scheduling woes are AD related but he might also be getting direction to take as many $$$ games as he can get. That might change some if the AAC gets a significant revenue boost (5-6X current).
 
I like the Wyoming game. They have a decent program. Much better than Louisiana or New Mexico in recent years. That doesn't excuse not getting the occasional P5. We need to schedule two 2-1 series. Starting one of the series a year before the other. That way, you would have 1 home P5 game every season 3/4 years after the first year.

Also, ECU has a state congress that mandates that they get home and homes with North Carolina Schools.

First state of North Carolina once threatened to do that but never followed through.

Second, as stated already in other posts and shown in our schedule, we do that with 2-1. Which is how we have played Central Arkansas three times and the OSU game will be the fourth A5 game since the stadium renovation.

Not only that but just being lazy will get us that. We have regularly signed 2-1s with OU. We had a home and home series with OSU for 20ish years. Since the bad blood and Boone we have signed 2-1s with them regularly. In other words we have built in 2 A5 games every 7-8 years based on other teams fans. We also haven't done a good job of building our home schedules around them.

Okie State next year, right? They may be a decent draw.
Yes but that's a 2-1. I get the whole set up for those and the buy games. I don't have a problem with them because the facts dictate the decisions. However those are two games out of 6-8 each year depending on the years chosen.

Other teams have similar issues with buy games and 2-1 deals and are signing much better games many with home and home A5 series.






Wyoming is a meh game and it is very possible they may go 2-10 or 3-9 this year and are very comparable to New Mexico.

Attractive home series need to have some kind of draw to them and not just fill out the blank spots.

We need


Regional teams: A tank of gas to reach programs.

Why?
The school is probably known by the casual fan based on proximity.

This is the area we should recruit the hell out of.

These are areas where we can attract neutral fans, especially transplants, as TU converts for a more local FBS team to follow. OU and OSU aren't the only big schools who can have fans that back Tulsa because their in part of our community. Winning and an exciting brand of football will help a lot to pick up the secondary spot.

They are close enough for our fans to travel to away games with out a big commitment. Traveling for the team deepens connections and strengthens dedicated support. If you can see the 6 home games and add two or three road games for about the same level of commitment it will only improve fan experience.

Their fans can travel the same as ours. Which means a better game experience for our fans, more butts in the seat. This also helps develop the draw for repeat games.



Names: Teams everyone knows.

Why?
Gonzaga effect, when teams are media darlings they bring attention, from the media, the neutral and casual fan, our own fans, and they often have some national support that will bring some support.

The tradition, teams like Army, Navy, Air Force are well respected and known by both sports fans and the general public. They attract eyes even when they have poor seasons.

The program, teams like BYU and Boise St come with large followings already and instant name recognition. They often come with rankings and similar levels of support.
The ability of nationally known programs to draw helps sell tickets in the same ways regional teams travelling do.


Independents:

Why?
NM state and UMass make better home games than FCS teams. BYU and Army are in the names category. Liberty is developing a smaller but similar to BYU faith based following. They all need games and offer scheduling flexibility.



Special Advantage teams: Rare cases

Why?
It'll be different in each case, but some examples are

Hawaii: Scheduling them for 0 week means the long trip doesn't eat into school time, our fans can plan it as a vacation, it's a bowl game like setting. Away game gives us an extra home game to offset some of the 2-1s and buy games we have to do to help sign home and homes. As a home game they are casually known from their June Jones days and our shared WAC time. Tend to be an exciting brand of football.

Ohio or Pennsylvania school: we currently have conference teams in both football recruiting rich areas, their are a lot of schools to choose from some who are known. While this is mainly about our non-A5 games Pitt has signed home and home series and buy games vs mid tier A5 teams are winnable.

California/Florida schools: See Ohio and Pennsylvania

Neutral field games: BYU has successfully pulled off a strategy of signing 0-1-1 deals where they play someone away and then have a neutral game vs them. This is something we could pull off using an A5 team who wants more Dallas exposure. Say at LSU and then vs LSU at the Cotton bowl for example. Or perhaps Notre Dame. Even 0-2-1s would help here.

What series we should avoid:

Historically bad teams: no one wants to see a losing program, especially one with out any local recognition.

Teams west of the Rockies: minus the PAC teams we should avoid teams with out national recognition. They are too far away, the exposure is minimum and the attraction for local fans is nil.

Teams east of the Appalacians: barring the A5 their isnt much benefit or attraction for teams like South Alabama, Middle Tennessee, Coastal Carolina etc. Marshall and Southern Miss would be exceptions. Maybe Troy as well.

Several A5 programs have signed home and home series with our conference. Many A5s have signed with teams having similar or worse facilities in less fruitful recruiting areas, traveling half way across the country. Signing just one home and home with an A5 team every four years means that combined with our 2-1 we would have a A5 home game four times in a 7-9 year period instead of twice.

Making a solid smart schedule can help build a program.

Marketing the schedule shows everyone how solid and smart it is.

Good scheduling with recognized teams will attract casuals.

Winning and exciting football will bring the casual back to Skelly field.

Coming back to Skelly will make the casual a regular.

Regulars become fans.

Fans make a better program.

A better program attracts more casuals, who come to see a good local team play an opponent who they know of, or know is good.
 
Also, if we're going to continue this series with Arkansas we should at least try and get it as a 2-1 or maybe do the neutral BYU thing with them in Dallas
 
If stadium size was an issue of any import, Tulane would not be getting home and homes when we are not.


It matters. Being in New Orleans helps them some. But it is obviously not an overwhelming issue. Coastal Carolina just had a home and home with Kansas and I don't think their stadium holds 20,000.

We can work around it. We can schedule better. We can also be smarter about what we already do with our schedule.

Like since we have to play on a weeknight why not offer the home game on the week Tulsa gets fall break. Volunteer to do it on Friday night we know high school football won't be an issue. When a lot of people will take the day off as well?

Stuff like this matters. Turning negatives into advantages is a big deal.

Hell have the backyard brawl bowl done the Thursday night before fall break. Battle of the high school bands that day. Tailgate and concert that afternoon. TU game that night.

Now instead of fighting the high schools and tradition, you're harnessing it. You give Jenks/Union/BA/Owasso a chance to practice their band show and attract them too. The whole day becomes a giant positive experience associated with TU, capped off with a nationally televised game.
 
Wow... that was a wall of bleh ideas.... good job.

Just schedule two 2-1 series and offset their start by a season. NOT necessarily with OU or OSU. Maybe try to get a KState, Nebraska, Iowa, Illinois, Northwestern, TTech, TCU, Mizzou, Ole Miss or Arizona State. They should all be legitimate possibilities for 2-1's.

If you line them up going:

0 1 0 0 1 0 0 1 0
X 0 1 0 0 1 0 0 1

With 1 being a home game... that means you get a P5 home game 2/3 seasons, and if we quit playing OU or OSU... it would mean we might actually have a chance to get some road victories in the seasons where we don't get the home game. It's the best we're likely to get given our current attendance issues and our recruiting grounds. That would leave us with two other games a year that could be split between an SDSU / BYU / CSU / Boise / Wyoming level and a low D1 / FCS level.
 
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:frustrated:

Ideally we stomp them. Then refuse to play in Arkansas again till they play here.

The Arkansas/Tulsa series is about even in home games now. At the very least we should be on similar terms with them as we are on with OU (the only one who really deserves a 2-1) and OSU.

Honestly I think we should sign combined deals.

OU/OSU 2-1 football, 1-1-2 for basketball, a home game each, once in Tulsa, once in OKC off set from each other.

Arkansas the same but Tulsa and Little Rock for the "neutral" games.
 
Wow... that was a wall of bleh ideas.... good job.

Just schedule two 2-1 series and offset their start by a season. NOT necessarily with OU or OSU. Maybe try to get a KState, Nebraska, Iowa, Illinois, Northwestern, TTech, TCU, Mizzou, Ole Miss or Arizona State. They should all be legitimate possibilities for 2-1's.

If you line them up going:

0 1 0 0 1 0 0 1 0
0 1 0 0 1 0 0 1

With 1 being a home game... that means you get a P5 home game 2/3 seasons, and if we quit playing OU or OSU... it would mean we might actually have a chance to get some road victories in the seasons where we don't get the home game. It's the best we're likely to get given our current attendance issues and our recruiting grounds. That would leave us with two other games a year that could be split between an SDSU / CSU / Boise / Wyoming level and a low D1 / FCS level.

Umm, so we're going with 1 home game every 3 years ooc?

You can only sign a limited amount of 2 for 1s or you'll start running out of home games you can have to fulfill contracts.

.T1. .T2 . .T3. .T4. .T5. .T6.
.A . .H. .H. .A. .0. .0.
.H. .A. .A. .H. .0. .0.
.A. .A . .0 . .0. .H. .H.

.A. .H. .0. .0. .A. .A.
.H. .A. .H. .A. .0. .0.
.A. .A. .A. .H. .0. .0.
 
Yeah, Tulane's stadium is, at best, only marginally larger than Chapman. When they showed the game against Memphis last week, I didn't realize how small the visitor's side bleachers were. It reminded me of the new stadiums you are seeing in MLS minus the weather canopies. And reminder- Ford Stadium at SMU has a listed capacity of 32,000.

I believe a large part of our scheduling woes are AD related but he might also be getting direction to take as many $$$ games as he can get. That might change some if the AAC gets a significant revenue boost (5-6X current).

SMU benefits from TCU signing a home for home with them and their Dallas location. The size is an issue but not the only one and certainly is not keeping us from finding someone. It appears that we just aren't looking.

All those money games aside and 2-1s, we still have games available to sign with people. Not just on Gragg (though he does get some of it) but we haven't scheduled smart with what we do have available to us.
 
Umm, so we're going with 1 home game every 3 years ooc?

You can only sign a limited amount of 2 for 1s or you'll start running out of home games you can have to fulfill contracts.

.T1. .T2 . .T3. .T4. .T5. .T6.
.A . .H. .H. .A. .0. .0.
.H. .A. .A. .H. .0. .0.
.A. .A . .0 . .0. .H. .H.

.A. .H. .0. .0. .A. .A.
.H. .A. .H. .A. .0. .0.
.A. .A. .A. .H. .0. .0.
No

P5 A (can rotate to another P5 every 3 years) Must start out 1 year before the rest of the plan.
P5 B (can rotate to another P5 every 3 years)

HH - Alternate Home & Home series with decent teams like those in the upper MWC / BYU... maybe throw in a North Texas or something. All you have to do is make sure you alternate who starts the series. Sometimes we will start it, sometimes the other team will.

Finally, you have your 4th game.... this game can be left open some years and some years you could schedule it in advance (specifically the years where it doesn't need to be a home game) If it's at home, it's likely that it will be a FCS quality team. If it's one of the away years, then it could be something like a neutral site with a decent team Since we would already have a P5 and a MWC level team coming to our place.

0's are away and 1's are home:

Yr: 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8
P5: 0 1 0 0 1 0 0 1 0
P5: X 0 1 0 0 1 0 0 1
HH:X 0 1 1 0 0 1 1 0
G4: X 1 0 1 1 1 1 0 1

This would mean two home games a season with one usually being a P5 team. (2/3 years) It would also mean that in the years we didn't get a P5 we got a quality MWC - type team at home, plus a semi-guaranteed win vs an FCS team to offset the possible P5 losses away.

I think that's the best possible outcome for out program right now.
 
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Also, if we're going to continue this series with Arkansas we should at least try and get it as a 2-1 or maybe do the neutral BYU thing with them in Dallas
They already play a yearly game against Texas A&M in Dallas each year. Doubt they would want to have a 2nd.
 
Ideally we stomp them. Then refuse to play in Arkansas again till they play here.

The Arkansas/Tulsa series is about even in home games now. At the very least we should be on similar terms with them as we are on with OU (the only one who really deserves a 2-1) and OSU.

Honestly I think we should sign combined deals.

OU/OSU 2-1 football, 1-1-2 for basketball, a home game each, once in Tulsa, once in OKC off set from each other.

Arkansas the same but Tulsa and Little Rock for the "neutral" games.
Arkansas' response would be ok we won't play if you don't want to come here. Arkansas doesn't need us on their schedule. You aren't recognizing reality. Wake up and smell the coffee.
 
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Arkansas' response would be ok we won't play if you don't want to come here. Arkansas doesn't need us on their schedule. You aren't recognizing reality. Wake up and smell the coffee.

Umm, I don't care about the Arkansas series.

But wake up and smell the coffee. Arkansas recruiting a lot of Colorado kids? Ft. Collins a hotbed?

They just signed home and home with them.


You also don't pay someone a million dollars plus to play if you don't need them. A 2-1 functions as a buy game for them.

But thanks for playing.
 
Mr pompous windbag, however you want to fool yourself, go right ahead...
 
No

P5 A (can rotate to another P5 every 3 years) Must start out 1 year before the rest of the plan.
P5 B (can rotate to another P5 every 3 years)

HH - Alternate Home & Home series with decent teams like those in the upper MWC / BYU... maybe throw in a North Texas or something. All you have to do is make sure you alternate who starts the series. Sometimes we will start it, sometimes the other team will.

Finally, you have your 4th game.... this game can be left open some years and some years you could schedule it in advance (specifically the years where it doesn't need to be a home game) If it's at home, it's likely that it will be a FCS quality team. If it's one of the away years, then it could be something like a neutral site with a decent team Since we would already have a P5 and a MWC level team coming to our place.

0's are away and 1's are home:

Yr: 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8
P5: 0 1 0 0 1 0 0 1 0
P5: X 0 1 0 0 1 0 0 1
HH:X 0 1 1 0 0 1 1 0
G4: X 1 0 1 1 1 1 0 1

This would mean two home games a season with one usually being a P5 team. (2/3 years) It would also mean that in the years we didn't get a P5 we got a quality MWC - type team at home, plus a semi-guaranteed win vs an FCS team to offset the possible P5 losses away.

I think that's the best possible outcome for out program right now.


You enjoy funny math?

If you are signing 2 for 1s you are -1 home game every series. Every time you sign a 2-1 you loose another game. The extra away game also means you can't use it as part of a home and home series schedule.

We currently have a 2-1 with OSU and OU, we make up the missing game by using an fcs as the home replacement, aka a buy game. Meaning any money we make off a buy game or a 2-1 will be less because we have to pay for a home game or have 3 ooc away games.

Math is Math and eventually the tally comes due.
 
Mr pompous windbag, however you want to fool yourself, go right ahead...

Oh so now Arkansas is paying us a million plus out of the kindness of their heart? Or because they have to have a certain number of home games?

Still no answer on why they flew to Denver and bussed to Ft. Collins for a game?

I said I could care less about playing Arkansas and would be delighted to leave Fayetteville with a win and never play them again.

The simple fact is they didn't come here because of Broyles whom we made come to Tulsa from the 1920s-1950s. The Little Rock excuse was always that an excuse. Just like OSU and OU, Arkansas has a good sized fan base in eastern Oklahoma and Tulsa proper. They also routinely recruit the area in all sports.

Us playing them does nothing for us beyond a paycheck we can get at 20 other places. I'd be happy to not play them, I am willing to give them 2-1s on occasion but there is no true benefit from a buy game with them.
 
They already play a yearly game against Texas A&M in Dallas each year. Doubt they would want to have a 2nd.

I think the talk is for that series to change. It will become a home Arlington home game. Arkansas is already losing a home game to Little Rock every other year. They just did a bunch of updates to Fayetville and used that to change the War Memorial game to every other year because of the money and nine game sec schedule they want more games in their actual home stadium.
 
All the specifics aside.

Go look at other local schools schedules and our fellow conference teams future schedules. Tulsa's is incredibly open and the games signed, barring OSU/OU, are not good draws.
 
When you find yourself having to quote multiple people in order to disagree with their viewpoint, maybe it is not every one of them who is wrong.
 
When you find yourself having to quote multiple people in order to disagree with their viewpoint, maybe it is not every one of them who is wrong.

Or maybe you're having multiple conversations at once and want to keep who you are replying to clear.

Of course having multiple conversations might be a little tough for some people. Hell reading comprehension appears to be hard for more people than it should be.
 
You enjoy funny math?

If you are signing 2 for 1s you are -1 home game every series. Every time you sign a 2-1 you loose another game. The extra away game also means you can't use it as part of a home and home series schedule.

We currently have a 2-1 with OSU and OU, we make up the missing game by using an fcs as the home replacement, aka a buy game. Meaning any money we make off a buy game or a 2-1 will be less because we have to pay for a home game or have 3 ooc away games.

Math is Math and eventually the tally comes due.
Dude... no.


This is how it would go:

Year 0: Start a 2-1 with KState, you play @KState don't care who else you play schedule all one offs. They won't matter anymore after you fully start the plan.

Year 1: Start another 2-1 with Iowa and a Home and Home with Colorado State (or someone similar). You start both of those series at their places... Now your schedule is: Home against KState, @CSU, @Iowa... schedule an FCS for a second home game and you're golden.

Year 2: Everything is pretty full. You have @Kstate, CSU, Iowa.. and you have an open slot for a road game, a neutral site, or an extra home game vs a low level team. You could schedule this one off as you choose.

Year 3: Time to start another 2-1! This time with TCU! You also need a new Home and Home with a good team and you need it to start in Chapman. Let's say you start a H&H series against Western Michigan. Now you have @Iowa, @TCU, Western Michigan, and a slot open for an FCS team to give yourself a better chance to bowl.

Year 4: Time to start another 2-1! This time with Mississippi State! Now you have TCU, @Western Michigan, @MissSt and an open slot for a low FBS school or an FCS in Chapman.

Year 5: Time to start a new Home and Home! This time we start at their place. Let's say Boise. Schedule: @TCU, @Boise, Miss State, and another slot for a low FBS or FCS at Chapman.

Year 6: Time to start a new 2-1! This time it's with Tech. You now have @Tech, @MissSt, and Boise in Chapman... Another spot for a low FBS or FCS at home

Year 7: Time to start a new 2-1! This time it's Iowa State. Also, you need to start a new H&H and we need to play the first game in Chapman. Let's say it's with New Mexico. You now have Tech, @Iowa State, New Mexico, and an open spot for a neutral site, or an extra home game vs a low FBS.

Year 8. @Tech, Iowa State, @New Mexico... open slot for an FCS in Chapman... rinse repeat.

All the 2-1's and H&H's would obviously have to be scheduled now for the mid 2020's as would some of the open 4th games that occur once every 4 years. But after you got the plan rolling it could continue indefinitely.

1 home game vs a P5 in 2/3 years and on the third year you would have a home game vs a good FBS team, and you could do what you wanted with the 4th game.
 
Dude... no.


This is how it would go:

Year 0: Start a 2-1 with KState, you play @KState don't care who else you play schedule all one offs. They won't matter anymore after you fully start the plan.

Year 1: Start another 2-1 with Iowa and a Home and Home with Colorado State (or someone similar). You start both of those series at their places... Now your schedule is: Home against KState, @CSU, @Iowa... schedule an FCS for a second home game and you're golden.

Year 2: Everything is pretty full. You have @Kstate, CSU, Iowa.. and you have an open slot for a road game, a neutral site, or an extra home game vs a low level team. You could schedule this one off as you choose.

Year 3: Time to start another 2-1! This time with TCU! You also need a new Home and Home with a good team and you need it to start in Chapman. Let's say you start a H&H series against Western Michigan. Now you have @Iowa, @TCU, Western Michigan, and a slot open for an FCS team to give yourself a better chance to bowl.

Year 4: Time to start another 2-1! This time with Mississippi State! Now you have TCU, @Western Michigan, @MissSt and an open slot for a low FBS school or an FCS in Chapman.

Year 5: Time to start a new Home and Home! This time we start at their place. Let's say Boise. Schedule: @TCU, @Boise, Miss State, and another slot for a low FBS or FCS at Chapman.

Year 6: Time to start a new 2-1! This time it's with Tech. You now have @Tech, @MissSt, and Boise in Chapman... Another spot for a low FBS or FCS at home

Year 7: Time to start a new 2-1! This time it's Iowa State. Also, you need to start a new H&H and we need to play the first game in Chapman. Let's say it's with New Mexico. You now have Tech, @Iowa State, New Mexico, and an open spot for a neutral site, or an extra home game vs a low FBS.

Year 8. @Tech, Iowa State, @New Mexico... open slot for an FCS in Chapman... rinse repeat.

All the 2-1's and H&H's would obviously have to be scheduled now for the mid 2020's as would some of the open 4th games that occur once every 4 years. But after you got the plan rolling it could continue indefinitely.

1 home game vs a P5 in 2/3 years and on the third year you would have a home game vs a good FBS team, and you could do what you wanted with the 4th game.

So you're scheduling fcs opponents in for the 2-1s as I said to fill out your home schedule and cheating by making the Kansas St game act like a 1-1 by just shuttling that second game off. You also will still owe a game in the future year every year for infinity.

Math is math.

We also already average the same A5 game ratio. We have one home game every 3 years. Because we sing a 3 game/year series with 1 home game.
 
Ideally we stomp them. Then refuse to play in Arkansas again till they play here.

The Arkansas/Tulsa series is about even in home games now. At the very least we should be on similar terms with them as we are on with OU (the only one who really deserves a 2-1) and OSU.

Honestly I think we should sign combined deals.

OU/OSU 2-1 football, 1-1-2 for basketball, a home game each, once in Tulsa, once in OKC off set from each other.

Arkansas the same but Tulsa and Little Rock for the "neutral" games.

We’ve been trying to get Arky to play in Tulsa for decades. They say no. We say fine...we’re done with you. Then we eventually need money and agree to make more trips over there and never see a return game. Pretty sure that covers the Arky - TU relationship.
 
I wasn't responding to just this one instance.

Now you are calling me(and others) stupid and questioning our reading comprehension? You don't call out several longtime respected posters(not an egotistical self reference) without thinking bout it. That is unless you are just young, dumb, and full of... Think before you respond.

I'm thru with this jerkoff, he has been an ass from the start of his regular postings.
 
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I wasn't responding to just this one instance.

Now you are calling me(and others) stupid and questioning our reading comprehension? You don't call out several longtime respected posters(not an egotistical self reference) without thinking bout it. That is unless you are just young, dumb, and full of... Think before you respond.

I'm thru with this jerkoff, he has been an ass from the start of his regular postings.

Hard to tell what you were responding to, that's why I tend to use quotes on here. Provides clarity.

I was unaware that being a long time poster makes you infallible. I've been posting on here off and on since the late 1990s (off when there wasn't a rivals board, on after everyone moved here) guess that puts me on Papal like authority.

Me mentioning that several people on the internet have bad reading comprehension is calling you stupid?

Well I guess if the shoe fits.
 
We’ve been trying to get Arky to play in Tulsa for decades. They say no. We say fine...we’re done with you. Then we eventually need money and agree to make more trips over there and never see a return game. Pretty sure that covers the Arky - TU relationship.

That's glossy but accurate.

The problem literally started in 1925. From then until 1947 every game was played in Tulsa on basically a yearly basis.

1948-1952 we played back and forth. Then we played in Arkansas from 1954 till now.

For every game but 5 since 1954 Frank Broyles was the coach or AD at Arkansas and the major stumbling block. The series continued pretty much yearly till 1990.

During the early 80s Cooper made a big fuss over the games being in Fayeteville, rumour is Broyles told him it was just equalling out from Tulsa's run of home games to start the series. Our Independent status also made a regional game important and we built schedules around the Arkansas and OSU games which were played annually through two to three decades.

In the 1990s we made the statement about the distance from Fayetteville to Tulsa being the same as Tulsa to Fayetteville. Broyles claimed the requirement of the Arkansas Little Rock "home" game was too much to work around. We told them to kick rocks. Tulsa has played Arkansas a total of four times since then not including this upcoming game.

Our game in 2012 and this year are the first games in 60 years that did not involve Broyles. The old guard is gone from Arkansas, the Little Rock game is now every other year only, there is a good chance that our relationship to them is open for change. We have played them on even terms in other sports.
 
So you're scheduling fcs opponents in for the 2-1s as I said to fill out your home schedule and cheating by making the Kansas St game act like a 1-1 by just shuttling that second game off. You also will still owe a game in the future year every year for infinity.

Math is math.

We also already average the same A5 game ratio. We have one home game every 3 years. Because we sing a 3 game/year series with 1 home game.
I don’t know how you don’t get it. It doesn’t matter who you schedule in the zero year besides the first 2 for 1. Charlotte. UAB. UTSA. It doesn’t matter just get some one off games they can all be away for all we care. It’s just one season to fix the schedule in perpetuity.... or until realignment comes again. I didn’t cheat KState we would play 3 games with them. Away, home, and away again. You wouldn’t owe anyone any games as you would be scheduling 2-1’s and H-H’s mainly. The 4th games every year would likely be low FBS teams or FCS teams at home. Two out of 8 years they could be anything you wanted because you would have 2 home games against 1 P5 and one MWC level team.

No games owed to anyone
 
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I don’t know how you don’t get it. It doesn’t matter who you schedule in the zero year besides the first 2 for 1. Charlotte. UAB. UTSA. It doesn’t matter just get some one off games they can all be away for all we care. It’s just one season to fix the schedule in perpetuity.... or until realignment comes again. I didn’t cheat KState we would play 3 games with them. Away, home, and away again. You wouldn’t owe anyone any games as you would be scheduling 2-1’s and H-H’s mainly. The 4th games every year would likely be low FBS teams or FCS teams at home. Two out of 8 years they could be anything you wanted because you would have 2 home games against 1 P5 and one MWC level team.

No games owed to anyone

Because you still have the arrangement. You can't just say oh don't worry about this game it has to be incorporated in your scheduling calculation.

More importantly you still haven't answered how this is better than signing the 2-1s we have now with the lowest possible travel expenses. Or how it improves our home game schedule. Or why everyone else can get home for homes and proper regional opponents and we can't.

Your answer is more of the same of what we are doing but change the names from OSU and OU to TCU (who we surely don't gain anything adding a 2-1 with) and Tech who has recently signed a home and he with us.

Please try again.
 
Because you still have the arrangement. You can't just say oh don't worry about this game it has to be incorporated in your scheduling calculation.

More importantly you still haven't answered how this is better than signing the 2-1s we have now with the lowest possible travel expenses. Or how it improves our home game schedule. Or why everyone else can get home for homes and proper regional opponents and we can't.

Your answer is more of the same of what we are doing but change the names from OSU and OU to TCU (who we surely don't gain anything adding a 2-1 with) and Tech who has recently signed a home and he with us.

Please try again.
What are you even talking about anymore? What arrangement? I accounted for all return games in the 2-1 and H-H scenarios. The others would either be neutral site "one offs" or they would be home games vs bad teams in Chapman. The only other games to worry about would be finding two home games (likely one FCS and one low FBS) for a one-off series in Chapman during the "year zero" when you start the first 2-1.

The HUGE advantage to scheduling 2-1's not with OU or OSU is that it gives us a WAY larger opportunity to win road games vs P5's. You're a lot more likely to win on the road against KState than you are OU. You're a lot more likely to win on the road against Tech than you are OSU these days. It's just a strength of program thing. OSU and OU haven't lost many home games in the last 20 or so years, and we haven't played competitively at either of their stadiums since the 90's. Let us build our program elsewhere and we can come back stronger, and ready to beat them in years to come. It's kind of like hitting the weight room so you can beat your big brothers.
 
Also, the Tech Home and home came and went close to a decade ago, and a lot has changed since then... including conference alignment in the Big 12 and how the Big 12 schedules.
 
What are you even talking about anymore? What arrangement? I accounted for all return games in the 2-1 and H-H scenarios. The others would either be neutral site "one offs" or they would be home games vs bad teams in Chapman. The only other games to worry about would be finding two home games (likely one FCS and one low FBS) for a one-off series in Chapman during the "year zero" when you start the first 2-1.


We aren't giving 2-1s to anyone who wants
them and certainly not teams we could play evenly. WTF would we offer Kansas St a 2-1? Or Texas tech. You clearly don't pay attention to our conference and it's scheduling requirements, or to who other schools are signing.

We give two for ones because they make sense. A pay game and a short travel to play a traditional rival in Stillwater and get a return game from them is better than signing a 2-1 with USC and traveling to Cali.

You also are still not taking into account the fact that you have to buy games from fcs opponent to fill out the schedule (only now more because we only sign 2-1s with the A5).

You are advocating for what we are doing now which does nothing to help our home scheduling and clearly by our future series signed won't be.

If you sign a 2-1 with Kansas St you can't just say that we start on game two. The very first year you are counting has to have the first game in it. Go look at our future schedules and show me how you work that series in, you don't just get to say, that first game doesn't count we'll just put it somewhere.

I don't have time but I will pull up our future schedules compared to other conference schools.

Our scheduling is bad and adding a bunch of 2-1s won't help it except to tell every school we'll give you two games to come play us. Never mind our non-A5 scheduling, which is also crap.

Just as a preview we need more games going forward for almost every year than Army and BYU who are independent and have to find 12 games a year.
 
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We aren't giving 2-1s to anyone who wants
them and certainly not teams we could play evenly. WTF would we offer Kansas St a 2-1? Or Texas tech. You clearly don't pay attention to our conference and it's scheduling requirements, or to who other schools are signing.

We give two for ones because they make sense. A pay game and a short travel to play a traditional rival in Stillwater and get a return game from them is better than signing a 2-1 with USC and traveling to Cali.

You also are still not taking into account the fact that you have to buy games from fcs opponent to fill out the schedule (only now more because we only sign 2-1s with the A5).

You are advocating for what we are doing now which does nothing to help our home scheduling and clearly by our future series signed won't be.

If you sign a 2-1 with Kansas St you can't just say that we start on game two. The very first year you are counting has to have the first game in it. Go look at our future schedules and show me how you work that series in, you don't just get to say, that first game doesn't count we'll just put it somewhere.

I don't have time but I will pull up our future schedules compared to other conference schools.

Our scheduling is bad and adding a bunch of 2-1s won't help it except to tell every school we'll give you two games to come play us. Never mind our non-A5 scheduling, which is also crap.

Just as a preview we need more games going forward for almost every year than Army and BYU who are independent and have to find 12 games a year.
You are dumb. Dumb. Dumb. Dumb.

Our ability to "play teams evenly" has nothing to do with how anyone will schedule us. It has to do with $$$. Tech or KState won't come here on a home and home because it doesn't make them much if any money and it doesn't help them recruit, also they have fewer open OOC slots now that they only have 3 open non-conference games instead of 4 (as they did when the B12 had 12 teams).

@ Stillwater or Norman can basically be considered a guaranteed loss these days. Why do you insist on scheduling losses? We schedule 3 games with OU and OSU... only one of which do we really even have a chance to compete in (and even our home games with them haven't been competitive lately). Then you schedule buy games with big teams that are pretty much guaranteed losses as well. (Ohio State, Texas, etc...) Maybe we'll win 1/30 of those combined P5 games with the OU's, OSU's, Ohio States, Texas's or ND's. When; alternatively, we could be scheduling the weaker P5's and taking them down (like Houston, ECU, Memphis, UCF, Cincy, and USF are doing). Yes, they'll occasionally play a big boy, but more often they've been playing UCLA, Penn State, Pittsburg, UNC, NCState, etc... not exactly perennial powerhouses these days like OU, Ohio State, or even OSU have been over the last 2 decades.

I didn't start KState on game 2. I started them on game one. It doesn't matter who else you schedule in year zero. Right now, in 2023... we have ONE game scheduled. @Northern Illinois. Start my year zero plan then. Schedule our first 2-1 with somebody... anybody that's a lower mid P5. Get an FCS game which we tend to get year in and year out anyway and find one D1 team to play neutral site. Maybe Arkansas in Little Rock as it would be close for the fans, they'd probably even pay us a bit for it. We would have fewer home games for one season, but it would be worth it in the long run. After that, the rest of a much better schedule would start.

I'm not at all advocating what we're doing now, because what we're doing now hasn't given us a P5 home game, much less a winnable P5 home game, in HOW MANY YEARS? You're advocating what we're doing now... on top of trying to play one and ones with medium teams like Army or BYU (WHICH YOU COULD STILL DO WITH MY PLAN) My plan would help our home scheduling in that we would get home games with good but beatable P5's two out of every 3 years, plus home games with decent "G5's" every other year.

Lions don't hunt the strongest buffalo. They prey on the weak, the sick, the old... that doesn't make them less dangerous. Just smarter. (In this case P5 teams are buffalo... and G5's are uh... rabbits)
 
You are dumb. Dumb. Dumb. Dumb.

Our ability to "play teams evenly" has nothing to do with how anyone will schedule us. It has to do with $$$. Tech or KState won't come here on a home and home because it doesn't make them much if any money and it doesn't help them recruit, also they have fewer open OOC slots now that they only have 3 open non-conference games instead of 4 (as they did when the B12 had 12 teams).

@ Stillwater or Norman can basically be considered a guaranteed loss these days. Why do you insist on scheduling losses? We schedule 3 games with OU and OSU... only one of which do we really even have a chance to compete in (and even our home games with them haven't been competitive lately). Then you schedule buy games with big teams that are pretty much guaranteed losses as well. (Ohio State, Texas, etc...) Maybe we'll win 1/30 of those combined P5 games with the OU's, OSU's, Ohio States, Texas's or ND's. When; alternatively, we could be scheduling the weaker P5's and taking them down (like Houston, ECU, Memphis, UCF, Cincy, and USF are doing). Yes, they'll occasionally play a big boy, but more often they've been playing UCLA, Penn State, Pittsburg, UNC, NCState, etc... not exactly perennial powerhouses these days like OU, Ohio State, or even OSU have been over the last 2 decades.

I didn't start KState on game 2. I started them on game one. It doesn't matter who else you schedule in year zero. Right now, in 2023... we have ONE game scheduled. @Northern Illinois. Start my year zero plan then. Schedule our first 2-1 with somebody... anybody that's a lower mid P5. Get an FCS game which we tend to get year in and year out anyway and find one D1 team to play neutral site. Maybe Arkansas in Little Rock as it would be close for the fans, they'd probably even pay us a bit for it. We would have fewer home games for one season, but it would be worth it in the long run. After that, the rest of a much better schedule would start.

I'm not at all advocating what we're doing now, because what we're doing now hasn't given us a P5 home game, much less a winnable P5 home game, in HOW MANY YEARS? You're advocating what we're doing now... on top of trying to play one and ones with medium teams like Army or BYU (WHICH YOU COULD STILL DO WITH MY PLAN) My plan would help our home scheduling in that we would get home games with good but beatable P5's two out of every 3 years, plus home games with decent "G5's" every other year.

Lions don't hunt the strongest buffalo. They prey on the weak, the sick, the old... that doesn't make them less dangerous. Just smarter. (In this case P5 teams are buffalo... and G5's are uh... rabbits)


Literally the moment you get a clue it will be your first and you might have some idea about what you spout out at.

First as proven by Jesse TU and me on multiple occasions every other program in our conference is signing home and homes with A5 opponents.

Coastal Carolina just did a home and home with Kansas. We don't need 2-1 deals there are 3 teams where that makes sense. Arkansas, Oklahoma, and Ok state. The travel is short, they boost our attendance, and the money will be good. Arkansas doesn't seem interested.

Kansas, Kansas St, Texas Tech, Baylor, Iowa St, West Virginia have all signed 1-1 deals with our conference teams or worse programs.

Missouri, Arkansas, Vandy, Kentucky, South Carolina, Mississippi St have signed home and homes with our conference teams or worse programs.

UCLA, Arizona, Arizona St, Colorado, Washington State, Cal, Oregon, Oregon St, and Utah have all signed home and home games with teams from our conference or programs of similar stature/resources.

Pitt, Syracuse, Boston College, NC State, UNC, Virginia, Virginia Tech, Wake, Duke, Georgia Tech have all signed home and home games with our conference or programs of similar stature.

Maryland, Rutgers, Indiana, Illinois, Northwestern have all signed home and homes with our conference teams.

Teams who our conference programs gave 2-1 to or buy games.
Texas, Florida, Florida St., Notre Dame, Penn St, Miami, Oklahoma, Ohio St, USC, Michigan St. We will get a buy vs Ole Miss, then our 2-1 with Ok state and USF signing a weird 2-1 with Louisville.

We don't need to hand out 2-1s. If Arkansas or OU wants one sure. Ok State makes sense. Otherwise there are plenty of teams we can sign home and home
 
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