Brin ran with the 1s while Smith was out
- Thread starter Hurricanetown1
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Monty will never let anyone show what they can do. If he could he would stand next to the QB and tell him who to throw to
based on the evaluation of the OC / QB coach, whose choices Saturday were a real mess.
Don’t you think it’s a bit of a coincidence that somehow year after year Monty or Blankenship or Graham(put in Bower!) are always hiding a world beater QB on the bench and refusing to play their best players? The other guys could eventually be better, but at this point they’re not. The problem ain’t the QB.
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Gundy’ s true 3rd string FR QB was better in the game than his 2nd string. Bet he didn’t know that from practice. Some guys are better practice players, some are better game players. How will you know that?
It’s rare at any job that someone with no or little experience or training is better than the person who has been around awhile. But everyone loves a prospect until they make a mistake. If they are able to demonstrate they are better under pressure, it can completely change an organization, sometimes for the good, other times for the bad. Particularly if that personality is dynamic or polarizing. QB2 might be slightly better than QB1 but leveraging out an extra win or two may not be worth having the open dissent of the WRs or the defense or your line or half your coaches that comes with a QB controversy. That’s why you hear that if you have two QBs you really have none.
That said, we’ve heard too many times on here from parents and people close to the program that Montgomery is committed to a seniors play/favorites philosophy. We’ve already seen that philosophy hurt us with President and others.
I wouldn’t play Brin now, especially with my job on the line. But I’d be looking for opportunities for him to get comfortable back there. Vision, breathing, heart rate, muscle memory/coordination, speech, judgment. All of these things are dramatically changed under game pressure. Even when we are down 35 in the 4th. He will need the experience later.
Especially if I thought 5 wins and close loss to OSU saves my job, we are half way through conference play with 2 or 3 wins, and Smith is playing hurt and not moving the ball.
That said, we’ve heard too many times on here from parents and people close to the program that Montgomery is committed to a seniors play/favorites philosophy. We’ve already seen that philosophy hurt us with President and others.
I wouldn’t play Brin now, especially with my job on the line. But I’d be looking for opportunities for him to get comfortable back there. Vision, breathing, heart rate, muscle memory/coordination, speech, judgment. All of these things are dramatically changed under game pressure. Even when we are down 35 in the 4th. He will need the experience later.
Especially if I thought 5 wins and close loss to OSU saves my job, we are half way through conference play with 2 or 3 wins, and Smith is playing hurt and not moving the ball.
Like I said, it’s a crazy coincidence that each of our last 3 coaches have all decided to sit our best QBs on the bench.
There are exactly zero coaches in America who would not have Zach Smith starting right now. I also put no stock in the whining of angry parents and neither should anyone else.
There are exactly zero coaches in America who would not have Zach Smith starting right now. I also put no stock in the whining of angry parents and neither should anyone else.
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I think history proves that Skipper was a better QB and better suited athlete for the system. President was probably the more mature leader. Neither was close to an FBS QB. One maniac on here complaining about playing time or the lack of a hitting coach in the softball program is one thing. It’s another to hear it over several years, from multiple parents, on and off here, corroborating what I hear from athletics staff and what current students say their classmates on the team tell them.
Maybe I missed something ... I don’t think parents are complaining about playing time. I was just saying the QB room is full of talent and that there are options. The reality is this team is loaded at many positions. The players want to win...... when the announcers have a conversation about the state of the university with an interim president and an interim AD that they are not sure that either have the authority to get rid of the coach ...... what else needs to be said . Who talks about who can fire a coach during a game on ESPN??? Not a great look for us at all. With real leadership and coaching this team could win the conference. Poor clock management , bad play calling, icing a freshman kicker , and all of the other skills the HC displayed VS OSU does not win games.
The QB didn’t lose that game. The coach screwed up the clock management, the coach called the bad plays, it makes no difference who throws the pass on the two yard route when you need 5 yards.
Yeah because good coaches and bad coaches never get it wrong.
Signed
Baker "heisman"
Kyler "heisman"
Joe "heisman"
Sort of. If I get bored, and there’s interest from folks on here, I can break it further down in fan terms the basic offensive set of TU and why we are throwing for 2 yards on 3rd and 5 and hoping the defense mistackles or falls down so we can reach the line to gain.
The short answer is that Monty is awful proud that the offense “takes what the defense gives you.” Raise your eyebrows when ever you hear a coach say that, just as you should when you hear a car dealer say something similar. Because what they really mean is that the defense has figured out what your options are, has limited them, and you are running what they feel they are best able to defend and making you test your athletes against theirs one on one in a very limited set of instances. We saw the wishbone fail in the early 90’s this way, most dramatically between Miami and Oklahoma.
“Taking what the defense gives you” either means you are imposing your will upon them or they have you so adequately defended, the defense is dictating to you what plays you run will be successful. This necessarily means they are deciding that you will run low percentage plays or plays that cannot reach the line to gain on 3rd down.
The truth is, that in limited situations, the veer and shoot, when it has superior personnel versus the defense they are facing, creates mismatches by design. This isn’t normally a problem for a defense, you can rotate and recover from that, typically by linebackers, particularly in the passing game.
Montgomery runs a modified version of the veer and shoot, slightly different than the Baylor version which reflects his obsession with expressing the physicality of the brutal mismatches in offensive line play he desires.
And that desire, together with inadequate WR, is leading you to the conclusion that the play being called is inadequate. On the contrary, the defense is actually calling the plays we run. We run a play based on what the defense gives us. Which means we run plays how and where the defense tells us to run them. Which means when we are inadequate at multiple positions, the defense can scheme to force us to subtract from our offensive playbook until we reach a play we can successfully run that will fail to make the line to gain. This is happening repeatedly since 2015 and it’s been my complaint all along.
Our base set is 3 WR stacked towards the boundary and one on the field side. The slot lines up a typical distance from the ball, but the other wide outs take an extreme wide position, at or over the numbers.
At the high school level, which is basically what we are running, that in theory forces the defense into three “zones” of concern. First, they must make a decision to give up defending the box on a one on one basis with our personnel to defend the pass. If they do, then we look to double team or combo blocking to create an unobstructed run lane for the RB to attack the safety. If the safety misses, you have a long run for a touchdown. And sometimes we see this happen to create excitement. Other times we see a pop play on 3rd and 23 for a gain of four and hear the announcer talk about the national origin of our punter for the 9th time.
Second, if the defense decides to stay at home and defend the box, then they must make a decision to defend the field WR one on one or with safety help. If the defense has a lock corner or our WR is not adequate to threaten the defense deep one on one, they can play him one on one and force him into a choice route of one of three options. If the corner has the quickness or technique to defend two of those choice routes, and most in the AAC and P5 do, then your QB is left with hitting the extremely low percentage outside shoulder fade route on the field side. If you go back and look, a lot of our long passes are this route, but at the cost of many incompletions.
So if your field WR is inadequate, or QB is in accurate or can’t time the fade due to poor line play at any one position, then two thirds of the field is adequately defended. There are exceptions of course and ways to manipulate that, but from 50,000 feet, from a fan’s understanding, this is what is happening. By design, we limit ourselves to one third of the field.
So on that one third, the boundary side, your linebackers have a decision to make. They can cheat over and help with the +1 WR mismatch against the CB and FS, or stay at home. If they cheat too far over, you’ll see the slot go deep post and challenge the safety, who may let him go to play the run in the box and cover his line being double teamed. (See above) That’s how we get those deep posts.
If the linebackers stay at home, then you have a brief period of +1 WR within 5 yards of the line before pursuit arrives to help. This is where you see the “wide hand offs” and one WR blocking and the other gaining 3 yards.
We can either do that, or challenge the defensive backs one on one. But we have to have the talent to consistently get open to do that OR have a mobile quarterback which the defense must spy and that will allow a WR who lacks separation the ability to find seams or be uncovered.
When we dont have a mobile QB, and we don’t have WR who can separate on the field side, or the officials are permitting pulling and bumping to frustrate what little separation our speed can get, the defense can line up and force into that screen pass play that only gets us 2 yards on 3rd and 5. If we get a play off at all, because our OC can’t decide which one of only 5 or so plays in our book to run, since he knows the defense has figured his cheap high school crap out and is daring him to come at them as they line up with the discipline to defeat him and forcing him into calling plays he knows won’t work. Without clear options, he makes no decisions and time expires.
This is why the Baylor offense won’t work here. And I’ve said it from the beginning. It worked somewhat when we had Key on the Field side and he could catch the fade. That forced safety help, which opened the box and the deep routes, which loosened up things for Lucas.
But we can’t recruit that type of player into this type of system at this school. You can at Baylor, where there is a surplus of talent and kids want to be in the Big 12. Nobody with NFL dreams at WR wants to come to Tulsa, sit three years, catch 3 passes a game (maybe if we happen to have a QB) and block 25 snaps a game. That’s just reality. And that’s why Baylor got a lot of kids with only one P5/Big12 offer that could play. And it’s why we are getting a lot of kids with only one G5/AAC offer. Their skill set limits their choices elsewhere, but they have some raw AAC ability, and they want a chance. The real good ones develop out of those limitations. Most don’t. That’s what we have. And the results to show for it.
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That is some serious analysis right there and something that has been thought through. I have a feeling that Huffy dropped the mic right after posting. Sounds like whoever we use at QB better make very good quick decisions and be very accurate in order for us to have the type of success that makes us bowl eligible.
That could be true. Why doesn’t someone (reporter) just ask Monty what was going on during those two weeks, who did what at practice and what he learned.
I feel like I have a better understanding of football after reading this. Also, I now realize that our problems with coaching will never get resolved. Thanks, I guess.
Thanks for the kind words. Im here to inform and entertain. Not depress. It will get better soon. Without this guy.
Very good run down of the basic offense.
Flexibility is definitely necessary here where we have limitations to recruiting. Playing to the strengths/talent of your players requires adjustments. Our best offenses have exploited particular match ups our players excell at. Garrett Mills comes to mind as a perfect example of this.
Monty has definitely shown he is too stubborn to change, even people with almost no understanding of football observe the repetitive plays and outcomes. This is a great scouting report on why that repetition is so obvious.
I have to disagree with this statement. Longevity is not necessarily a proof of talent. I have a team of more than 40 people and the best performer is definitely not the most experienced.
The repetition wouldn't be as bad if we ran the plays to perfection every single time. In other words no false starts, no holding calls, no delay of game penalties, etc.
I mean, Monty is OCD, right? Maybe the delay of games, pulling points off the board, etc is all part of his OCD ritual.
We had 28 false starts and 6 DoG's last year.
Good news is that in games 10-12, we had none.
So I exaggerated a bit. I'll change it to 2 false starts.
He probably eats turf and picks his nose too.
So I exaggerated a bit. I'll change it to 2 false starts.
He probably eats turf and picks his nose too.
We did have 5 false starts twice and 6 once.
I’d rather have the Malzahn / Marion form of offense than the pile of 💩we are currently calling.
I've said it before, holding penalties happen. There is ZERO excuse for a false start penalty by a RB or WR. I get an offensive lineman jumping every now and then because they tend to go on sound vs movement...if they wait for movement, they're beat.
Delay of game penalties are ALWAYS on the coach, especially at this level where players aren't calling their own plays. We seem to shoot ourselves in the foot with this every season and the last subs meaning Monty didn't have a play ready for the down and situation. To me that's unacceptable. And it's not like this is the first time this has happened. It has been a problem for Monty since day 1.
Mostly agree here, but we do have a tight end who just straight up tackled his guy several times. Didn't see anyone chewing his ass for it
Maybe one of the other 9 tight ends we never use would like that playtime?
I’m telling you, it’s because his playbook has been reduced down to so few plays, he literally cannot decide what to run because he knows none of his choices will be successful.
I wonder why we never (or rarely) run that stacked wideout screen that we used to? Not saying that's the answer, but that was Josh Atkinson's bread and butter.
We ran that play like 20 times vs Central Michigan trying to get Atkinson to the 1000 yd mark. We really need to run the drag screens more with JC Santana. Cat can fly so a LB trying to keep up underneath would be toast.
To be fair, that play runs a high risk of interception returned for touchdown. Happened to Dane against Houston, but the DB stumbled after intercepting the ball.
we did run a beautiful three receiver stack With a slant, and out, and a stutter slant that worked to perfection. I wondered if it could work in the middle of the field too.
If you throw the out and the DB reads the play right, it's risky, which is why you have to throw a stop and go in there every now and then and catch that DB getting too aggressive. Once he gets burned once, it won't happen again.
And Dane had so much confidence in his arm strength, he still thought he could squeeze a ball in between 3 defenders on some of those. I am OK with that.
Remember, Paul Smith had like 4-5 pick 6s against in Malzahn's offense simply because DBs guessed right occasionally.
See my diatribe above on this issue where defenses can jam or scrape away most of the routes for that choice and still have a chance to break up nearly every pass if your QB doesn’t have the requisite arm strength/accuracy/ball speed. You can get away with it at Stephenville High. The margins are a lot smaller in college and the officiating even more forgiving.
I think Zach has the arm strength.
Monty just hasn't done a good job really developing a QB.
Zach looked pretty good once he go into the flow in 3rd. He still held onto the ball too long a few times vs OSU but, he did much better with that than he did any time last year.
Zach has an NFL arm, there's no doubt about that. We don't have WRs that get much separation on any route right now so all the throws look tight and ill-advised.
