Afghanistan 2021...

URedskin54

I.T.S. Athletic Director
Gold Member
Jun 13, 2005
8,959
7,242
113
Mission accomplished. My guys Sadiq, Sabawoon, and Zikrulla are probably done for. Wish I’d kept in touch

 

astonmartin708

I.T.S. Hall of Famer
Gold Member
Apr 17, 2012
16,178
5,380
113
This is a problem

A) They say as many as X could be stuck there but might be in transit back.

B) Are American or Afghani citizens?

I will say that any American citizens who are over there need to be allowed to return home if they do wish and the admin needs to do everything in its power to enable that.
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: watu05

lawpoke87

I.T.S. Legend
Gold Member
Dec 17, 2002
26,229
5,574
113
I would add it appears Biden murdered (or authorized the murder) of an innocent man and his seven children. Is the person who green lighted this attack guilty of a war crime or is reckless and not properly vetted intelligence which results in innocent children being killed considered a “mistake” and absolves said person of criminal liability ?
 

URedskin54

I.T.S. Athletic Director
Gold Member
Jun 13, 2005
8,959
7,242
113
I would add it appears Biden murdered (or authorized the murder) of an innocent man and his seven children. Is the person who green lighted this attack guilty of a war crime or is reckless and not properly vetted intelligence which results in innocent children being killed considered a “mistake” and absolves said person of criminal liability ?

Happens more than it should, and in this case you had an admin rushing to try to get a PR win after 13 of our people got killed making a mistake more likely. Definitely was one that shouldn’t have happened and the giveaway that this was bad was when we wouldn’t release the names of the “terrorists” we killed. I wouldn’t say it’s a war crime but there should be accountability and no one left or right has ever seemed very eager to hold people accountable when stuff like this happens. At the very least the press should be all over them for just making sh!t up like how we knew we got the right guy due to “secondary explosions.” I’m also a little confused about how a guy in Nangahar, even if he had had a car packed with explosives, could be considered an imminent threat. That would normally be the (often valid) excuse for a mistake like this but I’m not seeing it here.
 
Last edited:

astonmartin708

I.T.S. Hall of Famer
Gold Member
Apr 17, 2012
16,178
5,380
113
I would add it appears Biden murdered (or authorized the murder) of an innocent man and his seven children. Is the person who green lighted this attack guilty of a war crime or is reckless and not properly vetted intelligence which results in innocent children being killed considered a “mistake” and absolves said person of criminal liability ?
You can only make as educated a decision as your information allows. Wish people hadn't pushed so hard for retribution for our dead soldiers. I can't imagine that the public pressure that Biden was facing (largely from one vocal party) didn't influence his decision.

If Afghanistan / Iraq should teach us anything, it's that, sometimes it's better to acknowledge tragedy and build better defenses for the future than it is to get angry and start looking for people to blame, because often the people who we end up hurting had little to do with the tragedy in the first place, and we just continue to make enemies.
 
  • Like
Reactions: watu05

lawpoke87

I.T.S. Legend
Gold Member
Dec 17, 2002
26,229
5,574
113
You can only make as educated a decision as your information allows. Wish people hadn't pushed so hard for retribution for our dead soldiers. I can't imagine that the public pressure that Biden was facing (largely from one vocal party) didn't influence his decision.

If Afghanistan / Iraq should teach us anything, it's that, sometimes it's better to acknowledge tragedy and build better defenses for the future than it is to get angry and start looking for people to blame, because often the people who we end up hurting had little to do with the tragedy in the first place, and we just continue to make enemies.
I didn’t think it was possible but you somehow found a way to blame Biden’s intelligence and decision to kill an aid worker and his 7 children on the Republicans. I did indeed underestimate you 😂😂😂
 
  • Like
Reactions: URedskin54

URedskin54

I.T.S. Athletic Director
Gold Member
Jun 13, 2005
8,959
7,242
113
Yeah I’m perfectly willing to lend some leeway on acting on bad intelligence. It’s not like Biden personally made the assessment that the dude’s water jugs were explosives. Don’t have it in me to go galaxy brain “actually Republicans got those kids killed” lol
 

astonmartin708

I.T.S. Hall of Famer
Gold Member
Apr 17, 2012
16,178
5,380
113
I didn’t think it was possible but you somehow found a way to blame Biden’s intelligence and decision to kill an aid worker and his 7 children on the Republicans. I did indeed underestimate you 😂😂😂
It's not all Republicans who caused the attitude, I think people in both parties fall into the trap and Democrats were certainly upset by the way things went in the pullout, but Republicans are the most consistently vocal in their appeals to anger and hatred when something happens to Americans. It was the same thing back in 2001. Something bad happens, so what do we do? We make rash decisions that kill more innocents. (Or if not 'inoccents' at least people that had little to do with the actual thing we were so upset about)
 

lawpoke87

I.T.S. Legend
Gold Member
Dec 17, 2002
26,229
5,574
113
It's not all Republicans who caused the attitude, I think people in both parties fall into the trap and Democrats were certainly upset by the way things went in the pullout, but Republicans are the most consistently vocal in their appeals to anger and hatred when something happens to Americans. It was the same thing back in 2001. Something bad happens, so what do we do? We make rash decisions that kill more innocents. (Or if not 'inoccents' at least people that had little to do with the actual thing we were so upset about)
Again….it was Biden’s intelligence and Biden’s decision alone to kill the aid worker and his family. Trying to deflect blame to the Pubs is remarkable. As I told my 7 year old yesterday as he was blaming his sister for the light he broke by throwing his football indoors. There are times when one has to take responsibility for his own actions. It’s the adult and responsible thing to do.
 

astonmartin708

I.T.S. Hall of Famer
Gold Member
Apr 17, 2012
16,178
5,380
113
Again….it was Biden’s intelligence and Biden’s decision alone to kill the aid worker and his family. Trying to deflect blame to the Pubs is remarkable. As I told my 7 year old yesterday as he was blaming his sister for the light he broke by throwing his football indoors. There are times when one has to take responsibility for his own actions. It’s the adult and responsible thing to do.
Ok. I’m waiting for Bush’s apology for Iraq and Trump’s apology for January. It’s the adult and responsible thing to do.

Oh, and while we’re at it I want an apology from Toby Keith for his ‘we’ll boot in your ass, it’s the American way’ schtick which is an evidence of the problem I was pointing to. Responsibility and all…
 
  • Like
Reactions: watu05

astonmartin708

I.T.S. Hall of Famer
Gold Member
Apr 17, 2012
16,178
5,380
113
When posters start blaming the Dems for either of those events you will have your equivalent.
Pretty sure that there have been who pointed out certain Dem’s Iraq war voting record. (Though that was a while ago)
 

lawpoke87

I.T.S. Legend
Gold Member
Dec 17, 2002
26,229
5,574
113
Pretty sure that there have been who pointed out certain Dem’s Iraq war voting record. (Though that was a while ago)
Don’t recall any posters claiming the reason Bush invaded Iraq was due to the Dems. As with Biden, his intelligence and his decision.
 

astonmartin708

I.T.S. Hall of Famer
Gold Member
Apr 17, 2012
16,178
5,380
113
Don’t recall any posters claiming the reason Bush invaded Iraq was due to the Dems. As with Biden, his intelligence and his decision.
I think it was argued that they did nothing to stop it. I actually think that it was argued by you that Dems were at fault (due to their bully pulpits) for Trump not stopping travel sooner early in Covid.
 

lawpoke87

I.T.S. Legend
Gold Member
Dec 17, 2002
26,229
5,574
113
I think it was argued that they did nothing to stop it. I actually think that it was argued by you that Dems were at fault (due to their bully pulpits) for Trump not stopping travel sooner early in Covid.
I never argued that the Dems did nothing to stop the Iraq invasion. I did mention that the Dems objected to Trumps China travel ban but I also acknowledged by the time widespread travel bans were being seriously considered by either party there virus was already in the US. I was correct.
 

URedskin54

I.T.S. Athletic Director
Gold Member
Jun 13, 2005
8,959
7,242
113
We have a foreign policy establishment completely detached from reality. Who exactly is this message for? Is there a group of people somewhere that gets excited when you scold the ***taliban*** for not hiring an I&D director?

 

astonmartin708

I.T.S. Hall of Famer
Gold Member
Apr 17, 2012
16,178
5,380
113
I never argued that the Dems did nothing to stop the Iraq invasion. I did mention that the Dems objected to Trumps China travel ban but I also acknowledged by the time widespread travel bans were being seriously considered by either party there virus was already in the US. I was correct.
I wasn’t saying it was you on the Iraq thing, I was saying that Trump was defended for not cutting travel ties and Dems were used as a shield for that decision.
 

lawpoke87

I.T.S. Legend
Gold Member
Dec 17, 2002
26,229
5,574
113
I wasn’t saying it was you on the Iraq thing, I was saying that Trump was defended for not cutting travel ties and Dems were used as a shield for that decision.
If I recall people were pointing out that not only weren’t the Dems calling for travel bans at the time but were criticizing Trump’s China ban and pointing out the hypocrisy of the Dems now being critical that travel bans weren’t employed sooner. Never mind they wouldn’t have been effective as the virus was already here and spreading. Blaming the Pubs for Biden’s intelligence and decision to kill an innocent family is an entirely different situation.
 

URedskin54

I.T.S. Athletic Director
Gold Member
Jun 13, 2005
8,959
7,242
113
Presumably the ransom paid to get the remaining Americans out of country

 

astonmartin708

I.T.S. Hall of Famer
Gold Member
Apr 17, 2012
16,178
5,380
113
If I recall people were pointing out that not only weren’t the Dems calling for travel bans at the time but were criticizing Trump’s China ban and pointing out the hypocrisy of the Dems now being critical that travel bans weren’t employed sooner. Never mind they wouldn’t have been effective as the virus was already here and spreading. Blaming the Pubs for Biden’s intelligence and decision to kill an innocent family is an entirely different situation.
Wait you mean pushing for a stronger stance in a military withdrawal and then getting upset when the stronger stance is taken but ends poorly isn't the same as pushing to keep things open, then getting upset when things are kept open but the virus gets out of control? how so?
 

lawpoke87

I.T.S. Legend
Gold Member
Dec 17, 2002
26,229
5,574
113
Wait you mean pushing for a stronger stance in a military withdrawal and then getting upset when the stronger stance is taken but ends poorly isn't the same as pushing to keep things open, then getting upset when things are kept open but the virus gets out of control? how so?
Huh? We aren’t talking about a screwed up withdrawal. You tried to blame the Pubs for Biden’s faulty intelligence which led to him killing a innocent man and his 7 children. That’s WATU China logic or partisan blinders :)

As far as the virus, find one post where I’m upset about the “virus getting out of control because things were left open”?
 

astonmartin708

I.T.S. Hall of Famer
Gold Member
Apr 17, 2012
16,178
5,380
113
Huh? We aren’t talking about a screwed up withdrawal. You tried to blame the Pubs for Biden’s faulty intelligence which led to him killing a innocent man and his 7 children. That’s WATU China logic or partisan blinders :)

As far as the virus, find one post where I’m upset about the “virus getting out of control because things were left open”?
No, the Dems were getting upset because the virus got worse after things were left open. I didn't blame anyone for faulty intelligence (besides the intelligence contributors). I did blame (possibly) the decision to act on the intelligence on the unwarranted public outcry / backlash to terrorist acts that were more or less unpreventable given the overall situation. (Meaning the fact that we were withdrawing tens of thousands of civilians at all, not that we were doing it poorly)
 

noble cane

I.T.S. Athletic Director
Feb 25, 2002
8,745
2,596
113
I would have posted this sooner but they cut my microphone in the middle of the press conference...

Nf6
 

URedskin54

I.T.S. Athletic Director
Gold Member
Jun 13, 2005
8,959
7,242
113
The last two sentences pretty much sum up our military leadership for the past decade. Hypothetical SPC URedskin disregards ROE when he thinks there's an imminent threat on his patrol and kills a man, but it turns out the man was not armed....goes to Leavenworth. LTG Dumb**** gives the president poor intel/advice resulting in 7 dead kids....we stand by our intel and will take no disciplinary action.

 
Last edited:

URedskin54

I.T.S. Athletic Director
Gold Member
Jun 13, 2005
8,959
7,242
113
Good on the New York Times for looking into this though. If they hadn't these people would have just been added to the list of "terrorists killed" and people would be leveraging promotions off of it.
 

lawpoke87

I.T.S. Legend
Gold Member
Dec 17, 2002
26,229
5,574
113
Good on the New York Times for looking into this though. If they hadn't these people would have just been added to the list of "terrorists killed" and people would be leveraging promotions off of it.
This is the truly sad and frankly scary storyline coming out of this botched strike. Neither the defense dept or the Admin admitted to murdering this family. There is zero chance the NYT’s has better intelligence than the US government. We covered up these murders and there is no outrage. A person or several people in the defense department or Admin is responsible for the deaths of these children and no disciplinary action is going to be taken. It’s negligence at best and incompetence at worse. Yet these people are still at their posts today with no consequences.
 

URedskin54

I.T.S. Athletic Director
Gold Member
Jun 13, 2005
8,959
7,242
113
This is the truly sad and frankly scary storyline coming out of this botched strike. Neither the defense dept or the Admin admitted to murdering this family. There is zero chance the NYT’s has better intelligence than the US government. We covered up these murders and there is no outrage. A person or several people in the defense department or Admin is responsible for the deaths of these children and no disciplinary action is going to be taken. It’s negligence at best and incompetence at worse. Yet these people are still at their posts today with no consequences.

Sadly this isn’t really new though. The air strikes you hear about are usually only the ones Bush/Obama/Trump/Biden admins came out and announced. They’re not going to come out and draw attention to the ones they effed up by pretending it was a success (no idea why they did this time).

Drone strikes have always been the area where I say no to the neo-con on my shoulder. I have for a long time agreed with the left more or less on the idea that the way we do drone strikes creates more terrorists than it kills. We’re not rigorous enough with intel and there’s no accountability for failure. Up until now though they’ve pretty much gone silent with a dem in the white house.
 

noble cane

I.T.S. Athletic Director
Feb 25, 2002
8,745
2,596
113
Sadly this isn’t really new though. The air strikes you hear about are usually only the ones Bush/Obama/Trump/Biden admins came out and announced. They’re not going to come out and draw attention to the ones they effed up by pretending it was a success (no idea why they did this time).

Drone strikes have always been the area where I say no to the neo-con on my shoulder. I have for a long time agreed with the left more or less on the idea that the way we do drone strikes creates more terrorists than it kills. We’re not rigorous enough with intel and there’s no accountability for failure. Up until now though they’ve pretty much gone silent with a dem in the white house.
The drone strike... the cowards way to wage war..
 

astonmartin708

I.T.S. Hall of Famer
Gold Member
Apr 17, 2012
16,178
5,380
113
I would certainly support an investigation and possibly a court martial for McKenzie if he was found negligent of passing bad evidence due to lack of due diligence.
 

Latest posts