This is the Republican Party

Gmoney4WW

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was that this raid or the one in june when the doj said they got everything they were looking for.
You mean the raid in June that Trump stepped out of. The one they determined later, he had probably obstructed. The one in which he likely had concealed and removed the documents they found in this raid?

They haven't yet said if they think he had all the documents in the place in which they found them this time. There could be more documents he squirreled away in another place, again.

Yes they are talking about the most recent raid. I'd say you know that, but never say rival knows something unless you like to bet on long odds.

They asked politely several times, and less politely several times.

They took the first raid for a subpoena, in which he was notified ahead of time, to either permit the inspection of premises and/or voluntarily give up the documents.

The next raid was on a search warrant in which he got no notice, because he had not voluntarily handed over said documents in several instances before, when asked and/or ordered to do so.

Each step was less concerned for the rights of Trump, and more concerned with the retrieval of the documents. Only because at every step, Trump never volunteered all the documents.

What does it matter whether they initially thought they had all the documents in the subpoena, and/or later found out they didn't. The only thing that mattered is they had proof there was probably more, at the time they got the search warrant issued, regardless of former statements or non-statements.

What also mattered was that when they executed the search warrant, they found said materials at his residence.

Should they not have been allowed the search warrant with present proof for it, because some official at the DOJ had formerly misspoken. If it was because he said something before that was later proved incorrect. Should they not ever petition a judge with information the judge found fully sufficient at the time they submitted it?
 

Gmoney4WW

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yes the one where the doj sent a letter of thanks afterwards.
You don't think that letter of thanks was meant to placate Mr Trump, while the investigation bored on?(Just for your own clarification: Bored on as in the Boring Company, not I'm bored of talking bout this.)

Cuz I've got some land to sell you in Louisiana.
 

astonmartin708

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The irony is how similar the partisans from each party are on this topic and the fact the neither will acknowledge the same (see WATU as an example).

Except there existed actual evidentiary ties to Russia in and around the Trump campaign. Heck, his campaign leader went to jail for it. I’m pretty sure the same can’t be said of Biden’s campaign and Trump’s claims.
 

lawpoke87

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Except there existed actual evidentiary ties to Russia in and around the Trump campaign. Heck, his campaign leader went to jail for it. I’m pretty sure the same can’t be said of Biden’s campaign and Trump’s claims.
Who specifically are you speaking of ?
 

URedskin54

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Remember “Trump is going to steal the election using the post office”? That was fun


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lawpoke87

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Paul Manafort.
Who pleaded guilty to taking money from a pro-Russian politicians in the Ukraine which predated his tenure with the Trump campaign. From this 62% of Dems don’t believe the results from the 2016 election. I do assume that number is aided by the Clinton funded no defunct dossier story. In any event, the numbers from the 2016 election are identical to 2020. The parties are simply reversed with the losers refusing to believe they lost
 

astonmartin708

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Who pleaded guilty to taking money from a pro-Russian politicians in the Ukraine which predated his tenure with the Trump campaign. From this 62% of Dems don’t believe the results from the 2016 election. I do assume that number is aided by the Clinton funded no defunct dossier story. In any event, the numbers from the 2016 election are identical to 2020. The parties are simply reversed with the losers refusing to believe they lost
Just because he plea bargained doesn’t mean that the fact that he was continuing contact with Russian assets up to and during the campaign any less relevant. Him and Gates were meeting with Russian representatives during the election.

By the way, Manafort was a main character in the Steele dossier and his contacts were actually legitimately described within it. Not everything in the dossier May behave been true, but to call it defunct is wrong as well.

You keep making false equivalencies between the parties and that is why you will never realize how completely screwed up the Republican Party is. The Dems are by no means perfect (or even passable) but the R’s are in a league of their own when it comes to being despicable.
 

lawpoke87

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Just because he plea bargained doesn’t mean that the fact that he was continuing contact with Russian assets up to and during the campaign any less relevant. Him and Gates were meeting with Russian representatives during the election.

By the way, Manafort was a main character in the Steele dossier and his contacts were actually legitimately described within it. Not everything in the dossier May behave been true, but to call it defunct is wrong as well.

You keep making false equivalencies between the parties and that is why you will never realize how completely screwed up the Republican Party is. The Dems are by no means perfect (or even passable) but the R’s are in a league of their own when it comes to being despicable.
…and the Clinton campaigned hired Steele to meet with Russian operatives as part of her efforts to dig up dirt on Trump in hopes said dirt from the Russians would influence the election. False information which added to the belief on part of the Dems that the election was invalid.

I simply posted polling data showing both parties by identical percentages believe the election they lost was rigged. No false equivalency there just numbers which are accurate.

I currently have no use for either party. Both are corrupt and are willing to do anything and everything for power. As a small business owner I do find it very difficult to support democratic economic policies. As a human being I find it hard to support many of the Republican social policies such as abortion, gay marriage, etc.. I’m obviously not far enough left to support some of the transgender stuff which I view as anti-female.

In short, I need a new political party. One with some common sense on the major issues we face.
 

Gmoney4WW

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Just because he plea bargained doesn’t mean that the fact that he was continuing contact with Russian assets up to and during the campaign any less relevant. Him and Gates were meeting with Russian representatives during the election.

By the way, Manafort was a main character in the Steele dossier and his contacts were actually legitimately described within it. Not everything in the dossier May behave been true, but to call it defunct is wrong as well.

You keep making false equivalencies between the parties and that is why you will never realize how completely screwed up the Republican Party is. The Dems are by no means perfect (or even passable) but the R’s are in a league of their own when it comes to being despicable.

…and the Clinton campaigned hired Steele to meet with Russian operatives as part of her efforts to dig up dirt on Trump in hopes said dirt from the Russians would influence the election. False information which added to the belief on part of the Dems that the election was invalid.

I simply posted polling data showing both parties by identical percentages believe the election they lost was rigged. No false equivalency there just numbers which are accurate.

I currently have no use for either party. Both are corrupt and are willing to do anything and everything for power. As a small business owner I do find it very difficult to support democratic economic policies. As a human being I find it hard to support many of the Republican social policies such as abortion, gay marriage, etc.. I’m obviously not far enough left to support some of the transgender stuff which I view as anti-female.

In short, I need a new political party. One with some common sense on the major issues we face.
I think you are both addressing different things. Aston is addressing the politicians being corrupt, and Lawpoke is addressing the voters being deluded.(at least with the polling bout losing the election)
 

lawpoke87

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I think you are both addressing different things. Aston is addressing the politicians being corrupt, and Lawpoke is addressing the voters being deluded.(at least with the polling bout losing the election)
I would argue both of those are true statements. I didn’t mention Republican voters but they were likewise influenced by the crap Trump was throwing out there. It’s easy to blame the voters who were polled but in both cases they were being manipulated by their political leader(s).
 

Gmoney4WW

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I would argue both of those are true statements. I didn’t mention Republican voters but they were likewise influenced by the crap Trump was throwing out there. It’s easy to blame the voters who were polled but in both cases they were being manipulated by their political leader(s).
I just was noticing that aston didn't mention anything about the voters, his schtick was mostly about the politicians.
 

Gmoney4WW

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some precient accounted more ballots than registered voters. but this is not a problem for the the dems.
Nobody accounted or counted more ballots than registered voters, other than your buddies who are doing this accounting/counting via VR.(VOICES in your head REALITY)
 

astonmartin708

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…and the Clinton campaigned hired Steele to meet with Russian operatives as part of her efforts to dig up dirt on Trump in hopes said dirt from the Russians would influence the election. False information which added to the belief on part of the Dems that the election was invalid.

I simply posted polling data showing both parties by identical percentages believe the election they lost was rigged. No false equivalency there just numbers which are accurate.

I currently have no use for either party. Both are corrupt and are willing to do anything and everything for power. As a small business owner I do find it very difficult to support democratic economic policies. As a human being I find it hard to support many of the Republican social policies such as abortion, gay marriage, etc.. I’m obviously not far enough left to support some of the transgender stuff which I view as anti-female.

In short, I need a new political party. One with some common sense on the major issues we face.
What I mean is that believing that Russia had an undue influence on our elections in 2016 (via things like hacking groups and wiki leaks which are corroborated issues) in Addition to having connections close to Trump, is not the same as believing without any real corroborated evidence that poll results were manufactured artificially via electronic or other suspect election tactics in 2020.

One set of issues has been confirmed by US intelligence agencies and multiple people went to jail in relation (also talking about guys like Lev Parnas)

The other has led to quite literally zero judicial outcomes or federal intelligence observations.

Hence, comparing people’s belief in the two issues is a false equivalency because one has some (even if limited) legitimacy and the other does not.
 
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watu05

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Hence, comparing people’s belief in the two issues is a false equivalency because one has some (even if limited) legitimacy and the other does not.
Immediately accusing the other party of doing the same thing has been a key Republican response since Karl Rove. This is a classic example of a false equivalency that serves as an excuse for Trump collusion with Russia to get elected. Trump's love affair/dictator envy for Putin and XI has not diminished. The dangerous element is how many American's view a Trump dictatorship as a positive. Perhaps they would respond that our system would prevent him from being a 'dictator', but it's exactly that system that Republicans have working hard to dismantle. The Deep State, Jan 6, the swamp, undermining faith in elections , refusing to agree to abide by election outcomes, etc. are all aimed at undermining faith in a democratic government and pushing for a dictator to 'just fix things'.
 
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aTUfan

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la la land
in the good ole days, the two parties would just disagree on policy. now you are hated. and the object of an investigation
 

Gmoney4WW

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in the good ole days, the two parties would just disagree on policy. now you are hated. and the object of an investigation
In the good ole days we didn't have the worst & most controversial president ever. You act like Trump is no different than any other. He ain't.
 
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lawpoke87

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Speaking of extreme and a bit crazy…Rashid Tlaib Dem Michigan is pushing for no new funding of fossil fuels production. This includes requiring US banks to also not fund exploration and production outside of our borders.
 
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noble cane

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Speaking of extreme and a bit crazy…Rashid Tlaib Dem Michigan is pushing for no new funding of fossil fuels production. This includes requiring US banks to also not fund exploration and production outside of our borders.
Get ready for the constant stream of doom.. theres a hurricane forming in the tropics in late September.. 'cause you know sh!t like that never happens..
 

URedskin54

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Speaking of extreme and a bit crazy…Rashid Tlaib Dem Michigan is pushing for no new funding of fossil fuels production. This includes requiring US banks to also not fund exploration and production outside of our borders.

“Environmentalists make good movie villains because they want to make your real life worse”
 

lawpoke87

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“Environmentalists make good movie villains because they want to make your real life worse”
Hard to fathom there are members of Congress who can’t understand the consequences of immediately ending all funding to fossil fuel exploration and extraction. Even harder to understand why someone from her party won’t sit her down and educate her on said consequences.
 

noble cane

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Hard to fathom there are members of Congress who can’t understand the consequences of immediately ending all funding to fossil fuel exploration and extraction. Even harder to understand why someone from her party won’t sit her down and educate her on said consequences.
The amount of wealth destruction would be unbelievable.... rural school systems would be devastated as property tax values would collapse...401k's would be devastated as energy stocks would be worthless
 

lawpoke87

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The amount of wealth destruction would be unbelievable.... rural school systems would be devastated as property tax values would collapse...401k's would be devastated as energy stocks would be worthless
Energy shortages would sweep across the U.S. as well as most of the world. The poor and middle class wouldn’t be able to afford even the basic necessities as the price increases worked their way through all aspects of the economy. Civil unrest would soon follow as economies collapsed.

Serious questions…are these people simply too dumb to understand the consequences of immediately ending financing for fossil fuel production?
 

GoldenCaneKC

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Serious questions…are these people simply too dumb to understand the consequences of immediately ending financing for fossil fuel production?

IMO, the problem is that they actually drank the kool-aid people like Pelosi and Schumer have been serving. Pelosi and Schumer are smart/wise enough to not really believe it. They’re just saying it for political reasons and so they can push through their agenda on the back of a “climate crisis”. But some members of Congress heard what they (and others) said and became true believers.
 

noble cane

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Energy shortages would sweep across the U.S. as well as most of the world. The poor and middle class wouldn’t be able to afford even the basic necessities as the price increases worked their way through all aspects of the economy. Civil unrest would soon follow as economies collapsed.

Serious questions…are these people simply too dumb to understand the consequences of immediately ending financing for fossil fuel production?
No.. they know... They WANT IT TO HAPPEN...
 

astonmartin708

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The people you are talking about are the intellectual equivalent of a Marge Green or Lauren Boebert. Disregard As best you can.
 
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lawpoke87

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The people you are talking about are the intellectual equivalent of a Marge Green or Lauren Boebert. Disregard As best you can.
The person we are talking about was appointed to the House Financial Services Committee by the Dems. As part of that committee she overseas our entire financial services industry as well as the Federal Reserve, SEC and the US Dept of the Treasury. Not sure how we can disregard someone on that committee when she calls for the end of financing for fossil fuel exploration and production.
 

watu05

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So many key figures in Trump's inner circle have had their reputations destroyed, been convicted of crimes, plead guilty, gone bankrupt, been hung out to dry as pariahs or all of the above. Yet somehow the Maga-ites are dazed enough to convinced that they will benefit by their support. Guilianni, Manafort, Bannon, Flynn, Cohen, Gates, Stone, Weisseberg. HIs big lie attorneys are facing billions in lawsuits that are still marching forward.

Then there is question of sanity as Trump now claims the FBI searched his Mar-a-Lago home for Hillaries 'lost emails', not the classified documents he admitted taking.


The real risk would be electing someone like DiSantis who is smarter and more rational and would use Orban's model to install a more authoritarian regime.
 
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astonmartin708

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The person we are talking about was appointed to the House Financial Services Committee by the Dems. As part of that committee she overseas our entire financial services industry as well as the Federal Reserve, SEC and the US Dept of the Treasury. Not sure how we can disregard someone on that committee when she calls for the end of financing for fossil fuel exploration and production.
You mean that people are assigned to positions on committees and in cabinet seats who work against the best interest of the committee? Color me shocked! Eye roll
 

lawpoke87

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You mean that people are assigned to positions on committees and in cabinet seats who work against the best interest of the committee? Color me shocked! Eye roll
She is working on a little more than the best interest of the committee. She is advocating a total economic collapse.
 
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Gmoney4WW

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If you want to rag on anyone, I’m the one that’s typically designated. MCane isn’t historically the negative poster around here. He’s got to go through a couple people before he gets a shot at my belt.
Can't you trash talk better than that? Pull out something that republicans will buy into. There's radical pub's out there that support things your average pub would ream on. (and they are also on committees)
 

Gmoney4WW

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That would be more concerning if it wasn't so spliced into soundbites. You know some of that wouldn't in the video clip if they provided more contextual editing.
 

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