TU hires Deborah Gist
- Thread starter TULSARISING
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I've always liked her hair. Lol. Something about the grey streak.
Take away the over $600k stolen funds and terrible academic performance of TPS under her watch and she did just fine. Looking forward to her advising TU going forward. TPS was paying her almost $300k a year. Assume TU is giving her substantially less
She had nothing to do with the funds that went missing. Someone is going to prison. I don’t like some of what went on there with certain employees, but she had nothing to do with it. It’s a Ryan Walters talking point.
As far as I can tell, this is about navigating certain donors in Tulsa. She was good at that. I get tired of the martyr stuff, too. But TPS is a hard job. The district has some issues that other suburban districts just don’t. She had probably been there long enough.
As far as I can tell, this is about navigating certain donors in Tulsa. She was good at that. I get tired of the martyr stuff, too. But TPS is a hard job. The district has some issues that other suburban districts just don’t. She had probably been there long enough.
She is in all likelihood a good addition. Her resume coming into TPS was solid, but that has been the case with those who preceded her in the role of superintendent. It has been that way since the late 70's-early 80's when the oil industry fled the city and the economic situation changed dramatically as it began to contract and consolidate. Likewise, the demographic wildly differs from the days that Dr. Gist was a student at Memorial HS as daughter of a prominent pediatric physician.
True, that she is very well connected with community leaders that seemingly supported her through her complete tenure, and these folks were very willing and generous in supporting her initiatives. That certainly is the greatest benefit of her addition. She's certainly well educated, personable, and would be engaging in interacting with education majors if that was a part of her role.
True, that she is very well connected with community leaders that seemingly supported her through her complete tenure, and these folks were very willing and generous in supporting her initiatives. That certainly is the greatest benefit of her addition. She's certainly well educated, personable, and would be engaging in interacting with education majors if that was a part of her role.
Good points. And to that end, the education program is our biggest black mark in decades. She’s the sort of person that can improve its credibility with the people who matter. I don’t think she’s perfect, but I can see a lot of reasons we did this.
TU flew through the most recent accreditation review with flying colors including the education department. It doesn’t need help. In fact it’s a model now for schools the size of TU.
I don’t get the impression she’s doing anything specific with the department of education. Her role seems to be forward facing, such as helping us with the scores of high school counselors in Tulsa and OKC who have closed the door on TU because they view it as a poor risk for their talented at risk students and a poor investment for wealthy smart kids. One of the best ways to stop the enrollment bleeding and reach that magic goal of 1000 students is by making sure everyone who should buy local is buying local. If using her history with TPS, she can open even some of those doors she will be changing lives and changing TU’s fortunes for the better. And more than pay for her part time salary, I get the impression this isn’t her only gig.
I don’t get the impression she’s doing anything specific with the department of education. Her role seems to be forward facing, such as helping us with the scores of high school counselors in Tulsa and OKC who have closed the door on TU because they view it as a poor risk for their talented at risk students and a poor investment for wealthy smart kids. One of the best ways to stop the enrollment bleeding and reach that magic goal of 1000 students is by making sure everyone who should buy local is buying local. If using her history with TPS, she can open even some of those doors she will be changing lives and changing TU’s fortunes for the better. And more than pay for her part time salary, I get the impression this isn’t her only gig.
'I will be serving as Superintendent in Residence for Transcend Education and as senior advisor to the president at the University of Tulsa.'
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It was a black mark because of how it was publicized, and was completely avoidable. If my recollection is correct, it came down to the lack of filing the correct paperwork, and doing so in a timely manner that caused the accreditation issues. If I understood correctly, at the time of the accreditation issues, our students were passing the certification exams for licensing at a rate that far exceeded that of students from other state universities. Thus the quality of education was great, but the adults in charge dropped the ball on the clerical and reporting side.
You make it sound like they just didn’t fill out forms or didn’t put enough info in them. Far from the truth, but kinda sorta technically correct. They learned some lessons the hard way. Stead cut compliance and monitoring to the bone for reasons known only to him. A lot of good people got let go or moved around. Measuring and documenting academic performance for accreditation purposes is more than timely filing of forms. We couldn’t show our work because of our antiquated business systems/poor leadership and understaffing.
The kids are great. They passed the exam at a 99% rate measured over a decade. As usual, it’s self interested and underqualified adults that let them down.
Praise the Lord none of the people responsible for this situation being allowed to happen are still around.
The kids are great. They passed the exam at a 99% rate measured over a decade. As usual, it’s self interested and underqualified adults that let them down.
Praise the Lord none of the people responsible for this situation being allowed to happen are still around.
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I just had the Cliff Notes version as I'm not well connected. I was aware of the lack of documenting that would have been required to fill the forms and knew they figuratively couldn't cram at the end to finish the test. I should have included that in my post... I was attempting to say that the kids were great and prepared to take the next steps to enter the classroom and as always, it's the adults that sh!t the bed and made a mess of things.
I don't understand at all the hate directed at Gist. She is a Tulsan and certainly wanted TPS to succeed in the face of increased poverty and deprivation among students. She was certainly not a puppet of the teacher's union though she seemed to maintain good relations.
I hope Dr. Johnson will find new ways to improve the district but worry it will end up being a game of whack a mole.
I hope Dr. Johnson will find new ways to improve the district but worry it will end up being a game of whack a mole.
Gist needed to go imo for a number of reasons:
1). Test scores under her watch had consistently decreased. The number of failing TPS was unacceptable. Are there problems outside of Gist which contributed to our poor performance…absolutely. However, she appeared incapable or unwilling to take significant measures that would improve the situation. I’m curious to see how TPS fare under new leadership. If the decline continues then I will need to revisit this opinion.
2). One of her Administrators was able to set up dummy corporations and bill TPS tens of thousands of dollars which ended up in his pocket. He even submitted fake expense reports (one was for $50k) which was reimbursed by TPS without being questioned. He gave other huge bonuses again without being questioned. Gist did not want a state audit which found many of these details. I’m not stating Gist was directly responsible for the lack of financial control in TPS but as head of the district she does bear at least some the responsibility.
3). Covid was a disaster. TPS fell far short in their support and monitoring of its students. In many cases they simply didn’t care imo. Far too many students did absolutely nothing during the time physical school was out. Again….TPS faces difficulties due to demographics and economics of its students. However, the effort imo was lacking and the transparency of the number of students not attending virtual school was almost poor.
TPS needed a new Superintendent . Hopeful that Ebony Johnson is the person to lead TPS in a new and better direction. We will see but a change was needed imo.
1). Test scores under her watch had consistently decreased. The number of failing TPS was unacceptable. Are there problems outside of Gist which contributed to our poor performance…absolutely. However, she appeared incapable or unwilling to take significant measures that would improve the situation. I’m curious to see how TPS fare under new leadership. If the decline continues then I will need to revisit this opinion.
2). One of her Administrators was able to set up dummy corporations and bill TPS tens of thousands of dollars which ended up in his pocket. He even submitted fake expense reports (one was for $50k) which was reimbursed by TPS without being questioned. He gave other huge bonuses again without being questioned. Gist did not want a state audit which found many of these details. I’m not stating Gist was directly responsible for the lack of financial control in TPS but as head of the district she does bear at least some the responsibility.
3). Covid was a disaster. TPS fell far short in their support and monitoring of its students. In many cases they simply didn’t care imo. Far too many students did absolutely nothing during the time physical school was out. Again….TPS faces difficulties due to demographics and economics of its students. However, the effort imo was lacking and the transparency of the number of students not attending virtual school was almost poor.
TPS needed a new Superintendent . Hopeful that Ebony Johnson is the person to lead TPS in a new and better direction. We will see but a change was needed imo.
It’s a political position.
For good or bad, right or wrong, justified or not, turnover is not only part of the rules of the game, accountability breaks down without it.
P.S. Robust auditing and compliance would have caught the irregularities sooner. Thats on her, even if she didn’t steal,
For good or bad, right or wrong, justified or not, turnover is not only part of the rules of the game, accountability breaks down without it.
P.S. Robust auditing and compliance would have caught the irregularities sooner. Thats on her, even if she didn’t steal,
Fair enough. I just don't see the vitriol. And I had kids in TPS during her tenure.
Don’t know enough about her or the situation to comment on the politics. Just a general observation.
People claiming she stole or people claiming she is being scapegoated are focused on the wrong issues. And that is turnover is both inevitable and desirable for these types of positions. The overall performance record, whether due to her leadership or not, indicates the need for change.
The policy problem, and therefore the political touch point, is Oklahoma’s adherence to Jim Crow era independent school districts. A lot of these problems she’s being tied to, from what I can tell from afar, are systemic. You can put a great or poor captain on a leaky ship. They can make the boat more or less seaworthy. Some will remove the water better than others. It’s still going to take on water until the holes are plugged, now matter how many buckets you have on board or how well paid your union oarsman are that are doing the bailing.
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Like I said Dr Johnson is at risk of playing whack a mole. She may bring many schools out of the lowest reading proficiency category but at what cost?
What is a better model BTW?
Im not a professional K-12 educator and you are closer to that than I am, though I did teach undergraduates for quite awhile.
I’m just a country lawyer, but you don’t have to be Atticus Finch to see the injustice of trying to teach kids that schools were once segregated in 4th hour, then busing them across town to play a bunch of white kids in sports in $50 million or more facilities that they can’t otherwise use. I’m not sure I’d study math very hard either if the system is telling me every day that things will never be equal.
One school district per county like most of the rest of the country would be a good start.
I didn't realize that model was common.
My time living outside Tulsa was without kids so no real appreciation of these variations.
Do we have cities that are in multiple counties? That would be one point of confusion with moving to that kind of model, though surmountable I'm sure.
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I see somewhat little of concern. Some invoices that weren’t properly accounted for, some bonuses that weren’t properly accounted for. I would be curious how large of a pool of individuals those items represent. Everything else is related to people being bitchy about critical race theory and DEI… (not sure if you’ve noticed but a healthy portion of TPS serves Tulsa’s urban communities)
A see a lot to be concerned about. Namely gross mismanagement while Gist was in charge.
We discovered that TPS consistently failed to properly verify and document the receipt of vendor services," Byrd said. "A systemic lack of internal controls existed at TPS, which enabled mismanagement and potentially placed millions of additional tax dollars in jeopardy."
Byrd also said noncompliance flourished due to the administration's lack of transparency with the school board and the public.
The state auditor's office reviewed 37.7 million in TPS expenditures from 2015 - 2021.
From those expenditures, $29 million were paid to consultants.
Investigators examined 900 invoices from 90 vendors and 1,450 discrepancies were found in financial records.
"We found compliance violations at every step in the procurement and purchasing process," Byrd said.
Certain district leaders routinely disregarded laws and policies designed to protect taxpayer money,” Byrd said. “We discovered that TPS consistently failed to properly verify and document the receipt of vendor services. A systemic lack of internal controls existed at TPS, which enabled mismanagement and potentially placed millions of additional tax dollars in jeopardy.”
District leaders spent $25 million without following proper competitive bidding procedures, the report states. Auditors found 1,400 instances in which administrators didn’t follow transparent purchasing policies.
Tulsa administrators often used the district’s foundation as a loophole to make purchases and give employee bonuses without the school board’s knowledge or approval, according to the report.
The Foundation for Tulsa Schools, a nonprofit that raises money supporting the district, reimbursed $57.2 million in district expenditures and made $5.1 million in direct payments to vendors and TPS employees, auditors found.
State Auditor and Inspector Cindy Byrd presents the findings of an audit of Tulsa Public Schools on Wednesday at the state Capitol in Oklahoma City. (Photo by Nuria Martinez-Keel/Oklahoma Voice)Auditors also reported finding hundreds of invoices to vendors without proof or explanation of the services being paid for, Byrd said. Many of these opaque payments went to consultants, who charged thousands of dollars with little detail of the services they rendered.
Even a summer intern Fletcher hired in 2021 received $13,000 with no verification of the number of hours he worked, auditors found. The district foundation paid $2,100 for the intern’s housing costs.
A see a lot to be concerned about. Namely gross mismanagement while Gist was in charge.
We discovered that TPS consistently failed to properly verify and document the receipt of vendor services," Byrd said. "A systemic lack of internal controls existed at TPS, which enabled mismanagement and potentially placed millions of additional tax dollars in jeopardy."
Byrd also said noncompliance flourished due to the administration's lack of transparency with the school board and the public.
The state auditor's office reviewed 37.7 million in TPS expenditures from 2015 - 2021.
From those expenditures, $29 million were paid to consultants.
Investigators examined 900 invoices from 90 vendors and 1,450 discrepancies were found in financial records.
"We found compliance violations at every step in the procurement and purchasing process," Byrd said.
Certain district leaders routinely disregarded laws and policies designed to protect taxpayer money,” Byrd said. “We discovered that TPS consistently failed to properly verify and document the receipt of vendor services. A systemic lack of internal controls existed at TPS, which enabled mismanagement and potentially placed millions of additional tax dollars in jeopardy.”
District leaders spent $25 million without following proper competitive bidding procedures, the report states. Auditors found 1,400 instances in which administrators didn’t follow transparent purchasing policies.
Tulsa administrators often used the district’s foundation as a loophole to make purchases and give employee bonuses without the school board’s knowledge or approval, according to the report.
The Foundation for Tulsa Schools, a nonprofit that raises money supporting the district, reimbursed $57.2 million in district expenditures and made $5.1 million in direct payments to vendors and TPS employees, auditors found.
Auditors also reported finding hundreds of invoices to vendors without proof or explanation of the services being paid for, Byrd said. Many of these opaque payments went to consultants, who charged thousands of dollars with little detail of the services they rendered.
Even a summer intern Fletcher hired in 2021 received $13,000 with no verification of the number of hours he worked, auditors found. The district foundation paid $2,100 for the intern’s housing costs.
Dang, I hope she's not in charge of the TU endowment.
Don’t miss the overall. She bears responsibility not blame.
Whether it is K-12 administration, university administration, or even state and local government at the agency level, leadership is rarely attracted into those fields for the opportunity to effectively administrate your tax dollars. Very little interest or concern is placed on how you actually manage a $77 million dollar business. Most lack the familiarity or recognize the risks of not having robust auditing.
The result is a the absence of an auditing and compliance framework that festers over decades. A culture grows where nobody thinks it’s a problem a single bookkeeper can upload an invoice themselves and cut a check. Or there isn’t the extra step taken to individually document that each expenditure can be verified by a third party ten years later. These are procedures that government must have that many business can waive. Running an agency “like a business” is almost always a bad idea
She learned a lesson she will never forget. Let’s hope the organization has learned it as well.
The question every one should be asking is why the state government central auditing system was unaware of the lack of internal controls at this level.
It’s neat that the only person to blame is a criminal and somebody who is gone. Thanks for that info two years later.
Why are you paying for a multi tiered auditing framework that failed here in spectacular fashion?
Because the obvious inference to me reading the coverage of this report isn’t that this was a one off incident. It’s that the environment exists for this to have happened at an unknown number of agencies. Just like it has repeatedly happened since statehood.
Where is the recommendation on how statewide auditing failed to identify the potential for this to occur and why aren’t those people responsible too?
Whether it is K-12 administration, university administration, or even state and local government at the agency level, leadership is rarely attracted into those fields for the opportunity to effectively administrate your tax dollars. Very little interest or concern is placed on how you actually manage a $77 million dollar business. Most lack the familiarity or recognize the risks of not having robust auditing.
The result is a the absence of an auditing and compliance framework that festers over decades. A culture grows where nobody thinks it’s a problem a single bookkeeper can upload an invoice themselves and cut a check. Or there isn’t the extra step taken to individually document that each expenditure can be verified by a third party ten years later. These are procedures that government must have that many business can waive. Running an agency “like a business” is almost always a bad idea
She learned a lesson she will never forget. Let’s hope the organization has learned it as well.
The question every one should be asking is why the state government central auditing system was unaware of the lack of internal controls at this level.
It’s neat that the only person to blame is a criminal and somebody who is gone. Thanks for that info two years later.
Why are you paying for a multi tiered auditing framework that failed here in spectacular fashion?
Because the obvious inference to me reading the coverage of this report isn’t that this was a one off incident. It’s that the environment exists for this to have happened at an unknown number of agencies. Just like it has repeatedly happened since statehood.
Where is the recommendation on how statewide auditing failed to identify the potential for this to occur and why aren’t those people responsible too?
The $25M to outside “consultants” with little to no documentation is what caught my eye. No doubt people within TPS were enriching themselves and their colleagues.
I might agree with you on the comment that Gist is not to blame other than she denied any wrongdoing was going on and fought the audit. At that point she was not only to blame but guilty of trying to conceal the malfeasance. Is Gist still employed by TU?
Sounds like other people involved might be prosecuted Suppose we will see
If you leave your front door unlocked, blame yourself not the housekeeper or the dude driving away with your jewelry.
Which is pretty much went on here. Not only did the state not know someone was inside the house stealing, they didn’t know the front door was unlocked and didn’t require locks to be installed.
That said, you have a great point. She didn’t exactly claim she had no idea there was gambling at Rick’s.
My question is: what systems and procedures did the state put in place to protect tax payers dollars from this?
If we went and audited all of the districts in Oklahoma, how many of them would fail for similar reasons? I bet you it’s more than a few. The first people I would be mad at are the TPS accountants.
Laws and policies were in place. TPS administrators violated said laws and ignored said policies. Read the report.
Why would you be mad at the bookkeepers? It’s not their job to verify invoices are factual or that their bosses are following state laws and policies. They are not auditors. They keep the books based on what their superiors give them. Be mad at the people in charge. You know…the people who actually broke the law. The people who stole taxpayer money. They people who tried to prevent an audit of their illegal acts
Based upon my training and experience and what I have read publicly about this incident, it’s reasonable to conclude that it is far more than a few.
Auditing and compliance fails without multiple tiers of monitoring.
It’s not the bank manager’s fault the bank got robbed if the security cameras obviously didn’t work. Nor is it the regional manager’s fault or the bank board’s.
But robberies happen when crooks see there aren’t cameras or people watching them. So the manager is responsible, in part for the robbery, for not checking that camera worked, but more importantly the regional manager should have been checking that the manager checked. And the board should have hired a third party to make sure the camera was working, that the manager checked it, and that the regional manager documented that he checked the managers work within the last few months.
That this happened at such a large district, for so long, in such large amounts, suggests systemic breakdown of even basic oversight frameworks at the state level. Something that likely has allowed similar situations to develop unnoticed in rural districts.
I know one thing, if I’m on a school board in some tiny county and I hear that Cleta in purchasing suddenly retires after 47 years, anytime in the next six months, I’m hiring a forensic accountant, notifying the state, and inviting the sheriff to go to lunch.
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