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This is the Democratic Party.

WSJ reporting. Not a great look coming on the heels of leaking attack plans to Iran.

 
Walz is telling college students that Trump is planning to use the military to round them up and imprison them. Crazy stuff

 
lawpoke87 said:
Walz is telling college students that Trump is planning to use the military to round them up and imprison them. Crazy stuff

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Did you even listen to the first couple of sentences. You are sensationalizing his words and putting your words in his mouth.

"I said look, I recognize I'm on the top of his list, but don't kid yourself, you're somewhere on that list too, if you disagree with these people.

That if is a qualifier that doesn't say what you imply it said. 'If you disagree with these people' encompasses a lot of different meanings, and is qualified by if.
 
Gmoney4WW said:
Did you even listen to the first couple of sentences. You are sensationalizing his words and putting your words in his mouth.

"I said look, I recognize I'm on the top of his list, but don't kid yourself, you're somewhere on that list too if you disagree with these people.

That if is a qualifier that doesn't say what you imply it said. 'If you disagree with these people' encompasses a lot of different meanings, and is qualified by if.
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No one is throwing college kids in prison for disagreeing with a government policy. It’s per sensationalism. The worst we’ve seen has been the censorship and silencing of those who disagree with the government and his political partner did it. Again. No one is throwing students in prison for disagreeing with policy. This is beyond dumb and reeks of desperation. It’s unhinged rhetoric. Hell….if Trump is elected half the country is going to disagree with his agenda. Well over half on certain items. I have a list with which I disagree. The thought that I fear I will be imprisoned for posting a disagreement on FB or on this forum is beyond dumb.

Here….i believe Trump’s position on tariffs is reckless. I believe his position on abortion is a violation of personal freedoms. See you guys in the joint.
 
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lawpoke87 said:
No one is throwing college kids in prison for disagreeing with a government policy. It’s per sensationalism. The worst we’ve seen has been the censorship and silencing of those who disagree with the government and his political partner did it. Again. No one is throwing students in prison for disagreeing with policy. This is beyond dumb and reeks of desperation. It’s unhinged rhetoric. Hell….if Trump is elected half the country is going to disagree with his agenda. Well over half on certain items. I have a list with which I disagree. The thought that I fear I will be imprisoned for posting a disagreement on FB or on this forum is beyond dumb.

Here….i believe Trump’s position on tariffs is reckless. I believe his position on abortion is a violation of personal freedoms. See you guys in the joint.
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First of all we haven't seen him function in what is supposed to be his last term. He has threatened to do a lot worse stuff than in his first term.

But if you 'disagree with these people' consists of more than just saying a few words at a rally. And if one thinks what he said implies that a facebook post or some rally words is going to get you in jail because of Trump, well then that's just... What Walz was saying was a bit sensational and then you sensationalized what was already sensational. What he said did not make me think he was saying Trump would throw kids in jail over saying something at a rally, nor did it for most of the people listening. That is, unless it was some of the 25% that would follow Trump off a cliff, the ones that believe all of the conspiracy theories.

And Trump for damn sure has made what he's saying seen tame in his rally's. I'd go find an example, but I don't really feel like wasting time on it. I know Trump's Walz, VP candidate Vance, has praised insurrectionists, celebrated right-wing political violence, and dictators who committed some of the most notorious atrocities of the 20th century on several occasions. What is so shocking that Walz takes him at his word on the campaign trail.(whether he privately believes him or not) Walz said something slightly sensational which you could base off of Trump and his VP's recent words. But only If you really wanted to push meaning onto those words that really wasn't there, in the context in which it was stated? So what.

I think you are just wanting to find something to get up in arms over. If you are talking about what Hillary said, it really seems you are hunting for things.
 
Walz “if you disagree with these people you’re somewhere on that list too”. There were no limitations as to what that would be when he spoke to these kids. The rhetoric is unhinged at this point. Calling someone Hitler or those attended a rally is inciting violence against those people. It needs to stop.

I haven’t seen anything from Trump or Vance in the last week or two but if they’re threatening violence or calling their opposition Hitler or any other rhetoric then I condemn it as well. What we’re hearing from both sides is further splitting this country apart. It needs to stop. One of these morons is going to be our next President. How do you think the losing side is going to take that ? We have a dangerous situation on the horizon. This needs to be toned down. If not this is going to get very ugly. Politicians on both sides are going to be targeted.
 
lawpoke87 said:
No one is throwing college kids in prison for disagreeing with a government policy. It’s per sensationalism. The worst we’ve seen has been the censorship and silencing of those who disagree with the government and his political partner did it. Again. No one is throwing students in prison for disagreeing with policy. This is beyond dumb and reeks of desperation. It’s unhinged rhetoric. Hell….if Trump is elected half the country is going to disagree with his agenda. Well over half on certain items. I have a list with which I disagree. The thought that I fear I will be imprisoned for posting a disagreement on FB or on this forum is beyond dumb.

Here….i believe Trump’s position on tariffs is reckless. I believe his position on abortion is a violation of personal freedoms. See you guys in the joint.
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If he didn't repeatedly talk about "enemies within", I might agree with you.

If his first reaction to being shot at wasn't "fight", I might agree with you.

If he denounced the Nazis who to this day fly their flags at his rallies with impunity, I might agree with you.

If he stopped speaking longingly of Hitler's war criminal generals, I might agree with you.

If he didn't try to steal my vote as well as millions of other American's votes in broad daylight in front of our very eyes, I might agree with you.

If he didn't blame economic / criminal plights on his political opposition and ethnic minorities, I might agree with you.

If he wasn't continuing to chum it up with dictators who do in fact throw college kids into Gulags for disagreeing with government policies, I might agree with you.

If he didn't call for executions of government officials who he was at odds with, I might agree with you.

What you're asking me to do is completely disregard everything he and his political supporters have said and done for the past ~10 years. I don't give a flying flip how much he'll lower taxes or how he will deal with inflation. Neither he nor his allies should be allowed anywhere near the halls of government again. In fact, most of them should still be in jail for what they attempted in 2020 (And that goes for a handful of Congressmen and Senators who were in the plot as well). Get it through your skull. I can't even believe we're sitting here debating this.

If you ever wondered how the Nazis rose to power in 1933, you are seeing it. This discourse in this chat. This is it. Not everyone in Germany was a originally a Nazi.... but a ton of them were blinded a-holes who were lured into willful ignorance by greed frustration and loathing. Millions of people (their fellow countrymen included) paid for their ignorance and it left the ignorant who did survive worse off for generations.

If history repeats itself (or even rhymes), their won't be "I told you so's", but if there is some sort of cosmic justice, there will be a special place in hell reserved for those people who ignored every warning sign that their neighbors tried to illuminate.
 
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astonmartin708 said:
If Trump didn't repeatedly talk about "enemies within", I might agree with you.

If his first reaction to being shot at wasn't "fight", I might agree with you.

If he denounced the Nazis who to this day fly their flags at his rallies with impunity, I might agree with you.

If he stopped speaking longingly of Hitler's war criminal generals, I might agree with you.

If he didn't try to steal my vote as well as millions of other American's votes in broad daylight in front of our very eyes, I might agree with you.

If he wasn't continuing to chum it up with dictators who do in fact throw college kids into Gulags for disagreeing with government policies, I might agree with you.

If he didn't call for executions of government officials who he was at odds with, I might agree with you.

What you're asking me to do is completely disregard everything Trump and his Republican supporters have said and done for the past ~10 years. I don't give a flying flip how much he'll lower taxes or how he will deal with inflation. Neither he nor his allies should be allowed anywhere near the halls of government again. In fact, most of them should still be in jail for what they attempted in 2020 (And that goes for a handful of Congressmen and Senators who were in the plot as well). Get it through your skull. I can't even believe we're sitting here debating this.
Click to expand...
Same. Ordinary people believing
they’re going to be thrown in prison for disagreeing with a politician is unhinged. But here we are discussing it. Only one party has actually censored and silenced dissenting voices. Only one party has unconstitutionally forced people to lose their jobs for disagreeing with their policies.

I’ll make you a bet….if Trump wins I’ll wager the military throws no one in prison for voicing their opposition to his policies. I’ll wager he doesn’t censor or silence anyone speech. I’ll wager no elected official gets executed (except maybe Trump). The left has gone completely unhinged. It’s almost like they forgot he was President and no of this crap occurred. If fact the Biden Admin restricted personal liberties on a far greater scale . I know….thats different.
 
lawpoke87 said:
Walz “if you disagree with these people you’re somewhere on that list too”. There were no limitations as to what that would be when he spoke to these kids. The rhetoric is unhinged at this point. Calling someone Hitler or those attended a rally is inciting violence against those people. It needs to stop.

I haven’t seen anything from Trump or Vance in the last week or two but if they’re threatening violence or calling their opposition Hitler or any other rhetoric then I condemn it as well. What we’re hearing from both sides is further splitting this country apart. It needs to stop. One of these morons is going to be our next President. How do you think the losing side is going to take that ? We have a dangerous situation on the horizon. This needs to be toned down. If not this is going to get very ugly. Politicians on both sides are going to be targeted.
Click to expand...

Oh my god. You want the Democrats to calm down, but leave the Republicans to do whatever they want. Trump has brought the circus along for the ride, not the Democrats. Any zaniness from the Democrats is to answer Trump's crazy thoughts and policies. This all started in 2015, but you want the Democrats to lay down and take it up the... at the last minute.

It is going to be this way till the end because Trumps actions demand it over the last 10 years of crap he has put out. Any sound coming out of the Democrats mouths that sounds like Barnum & Bailey did not originate from them. You didn't see the Democrats saying stuff like this in either of Obama's campaigns, or Kerry's or Gore... Whatever politicians are going to be targeted on either side of the aisle, have already made their bed by being a member of their party.

No words spoken in these last couple of three weeks are going to make a difference. And if someone shoots at someone, or actually kills someone, and cites anything said from the past month, that's just justification. They would have done it anyway, regardless of the citing of a statement to blame it on.
 
Gmoney4WW said:
Oh my god. You want the Democrats to calm down, but leave the Republicans to do whatever they want. Trump has brought the circus along for the ride, not the Democrats. Any zaniness from the Democrats is to answer Trump's crazy thoughts and policies. This all started in 2015, but you want the Democrats to lay down and take it up the... at the last minute.

It is going to be this way till the end because Trumps actions demand it over the last 10 years of crap he has put out. Any sound coming out of the Democrats mouths that sounds like Barnum & Bailey did not originate from them. You didn't see the Democrats saying stuff like this in either of Obama's campaigns, or Kerry's or Gore... Whatever politicians are going to be targeted on either side of the aisle, have already made their bed by being a member of their party.

No words spoken in these last couple of three weeks are going to make a difference. And if someone shoots at someone, or actually kills someone, and cites anything said from the past month, that's just justification. They would have done it anyway, regardless of the citing of a statement to blame it on.
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Guess you missed where I said “what we’re hearing from both sides is splitting this country apart. It needs to stop”? Both sides. This is going to get really ugly after the election regardless of who’s elected. Convincing each side the other is Satan won’t end well when Satan is elected. There’s going to be more violence. It’s irresponsible not to tone down the rhetoric. BOTH SIDES. Hell….Aston believes college kids are going to be thrown in prisons by our military and politicians executed for disagreeing with policies. Thats how unhinged people are at this point.
 
lawpoke87 said:
Same. Ordinary people believing
they’re going to be thrown in prison for disagreeing with a politician is unhinged. But here we are discussing it. Only one party has actually censored and silenced dissenting voices. Only one party has unconstitutionally forced people to lose their jobs for disagreeing with their policies.

I’ll make you a bet….if Trump wins I’ll wager the military throws no one in prison for voicing their opposition to his policies. I’ll wager he doesn’t censor or silence anyone speech. I’ll wager no elected official gets executed (except maybe Trump). Crazy talk.
Click to expand...
lawpoke87 said:
Guess you missed where I said “what we’re hearing from both sides is splitting this country apart. It needs to stop”? Both sides. This is going to get really ugly after the election regardless of who’s elected. Convincing each side the other is Satan won’t end well when Satan is elected. There’s going to be more violence. It’s irresponsible not to tone down the rhetoric. BOTH SIDES. Hell….Aston believes college kids are going to be thrown in prisons by our military and politicians executed for disagreeing with policies. Thats how unhinged people are at this point.
Click to expand...
They are not going to calm down on either side, and it won't make one bit of difference. They could have put a gag order on both campaigns for the last month up to the election, and the violence would happen or it wouldn't. It will be the result of the election, and the person's pent up feelings over the result that will bring on any violence, not the words over the last month. Most people are jaded to what both sides are saying anyway, and those that aren't probably tend to violence anyway.
 
lawpoke87 said:
Guess you missed where I said “what we’re hearing from both sides is splitting this country apart. It needs to stop”? Both sides. This is going to get really ugly after the election regardless of who’s elected. Convincing each side the other is Satan won’t end well when Satan is elected. There’s going to be more violence. It’s irresponsible not to tone down the rhetoric. BOTH SIDES. Hell….Aston believes college kids are going to be thrown in prisons by our military and politicians executed for disagreeing with policies. Thats how unhinged people are at this point.
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Both sides my ass.

Wake up you ignoramus.
 
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lawpoke87 said:
Same. Ordinary people believing
they’re going to be thrown in prison for disagreeing with a politician is unhinged. But here we are discussing it. Only one party has actually censored and silenced dissenting voices. Only one party has unconstitutionally forced people to lose their jobs for disagreeing with their policies.

I’ll make you a bet….if Trump wins I’ll wager the military throws no one in prison for voicing their opposition to his policies. I’ll wager he doesn’t censor or silence anyone speech. I’ll wager no elected official gets executed (except maybe Trump). The left has gone completely unhinged. It’s almost like they forgot he was President and no of this crap occurred. If fact the Biden Admin restricted personal liberties on a far greater scale . I know….thats different.
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Censorship in certain forums is not, by itself something to worry about. (Many democratic countries have stricter censorship laws than we do) What you should worry about is when violent action against common citizens is alluded to. FYI Democrats aren't the ones calling for that.

And as far as your censorship claims with Trump goes, I completely disagree that his government didn't censor speech, and that his supporters (particularly Elon Musk) don't continue to do so today.

P.S. what Democrats did regarding vaccine mandates happened during a time of national crisis. Republicans are continuing encourage extraordinary and unprecedented incivility during times of relative national stability.

I do agree that the Military is unlikely to round people up, but the only reason is because Republicans aren't the only people with guns as much as they like to think they are. I could though see them doing something like they did in Russia and hauling peaceful protestors off for extended jail sentences delivered via unjust laws passed by some unjust legislatures. Considering Republican's historic detestation of Democratic protesting combined with their recent rhetoric it wouldn't surprise me. I could also in some darker timelines see them drafting dissidents into a bogus military conflict just like Russia has.
 
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Gmoney4WW said:
At the moment, it is one employee of Fema, not Fema as a whole. But the details don't really matter, do they?
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There appear to be written instructions given to this “one employee” who was in turn supervising and instructing subordinates.
 
Looks like it was a supervisor to his staff and he was dumb enough to put in writing. He’s been suspended. Doing this in a state with a Pub governor and Trump won by 13 points probably not a great career decision.
www.telegraph.co.uk

Fema official told relief workers to skip Trump supporters’ houses in wake of hurricane

Supervisor suspended and Ron DeSantis launches investigation into ‘blatant weaponization of government by partisan activists’
www.telegraph.co.uk www.telegraph.co.uk
 
lawpoke87 said:
Looks like it was a supervisor to his staff and he was dumb enough to put in writing. He’s been suspended. Doing this in a state with a Pub governor and Trump won by 13 points probably not a great career decision.
www.telegraph.co.uk

Fema official told relief workers to skip Trump supporters’ houses in wake of hurricane

Supervisor suspended and Ron DeSantis launches investigation into ‘blatant weaponization of government by partisan activists’
www.telegraph.co.uk www.telegraph.co.uk
Click to expand...
He was really stupid for putting it in writing, and the staff was moronic for not all taking it to his boss. So it started with one employee, and spread through one employee. The rest of his staff actually was bright enough to not carry out his order hopefully. It's still not Fema, it was only a few Fema employees.
 
Gmoney4WW said:
He was really stupid for putting it in writing, and the staff was moronic for not all taking it to his boss. So it started with one employee, and spread through one employee. The rest of his staff actually was bright enough to not carry out his order hopefully. It's still not Fema, it was only a few Fema employees.
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Yeah, I remember when they said that only one rogue employee in a field office of the FBI was investigating whether Catholics were extremists. That explanation blew up quickly and they refused to comment further. I’ll wait for Congress to conduct inquiries on this one too.
 
HuffyCane said:
Yeah, I remember when they said that only one rogue employee in a field office of the FBI was investigating whether Catholics were extremists. That explanation blew up quickly and they refused to comment further. I’ll wait for Congress to conduct inquiries on this one too.
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Like I'm going to ignore it if they find it's more widespread. I just don't have suspicions that it is more widespread, until I see evidence. Doesn't matter which party is in power, or which agency has allegations against it.
 
Gmoney4WW said:
Like I'm going to ignore it if they find it's more widespread. I just don't have suspicions that it is more widespread, until I see evidence. Doesn't matter which party is in power, or which agency has allegations against it.
Click to expand...
I’ll certainly wait until more information is revealed. That said…I can’t think of many things worse than government employees not giving aid to those in need during an emergency based on who they support for President. Hopefully not many workers followed their supervisor’s directions.
 
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lawpoke87 said:
I’ll certainly wait until more information is revealed. That said…I can’t think of many things worse than government employees not giving aid to those in need during an emergency based on who they support for President. Hopefully not many workers followed their supervisor’s directions.
Click to expand...
That plan in Oregon to distribute the CoVid vaccine to white people and Asians last was up there.
 
The main thing that blows up the "both sides" stuff is election denialism including January 6th and Trump's response to it. That is the uniquely bad thing about him - the ominous signal.

We shall see if our system is strong enough to make it through the next four years fully intact. I have my doubts.
 
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the votes have been counted, the dems lost, why cant accept that maybe they had a bad candidate and they were wrong.
 
lawpoke87 said:
I’ll certainly wait until more information is revealed. That said…I can’t think of many things worse than government employees not giving aid to those in need during an emergency based on who they support for President. Hopefully not many workers followed their supervisor’s directions.
Click to expand...
Is it worse for a low level official try and deny aid, or for a senior elected official to do so by denying (or delaying) funding? It seems like every time a hurricane happens in Virginia, or a fire in California, we get a diatribe from Fox News talking heads about needing to approve the current conservative hinge issue (immigration reform, police funding, etc...) before the Democratic states can get help.

Both seem equally bad to me, and I denounce them both (including this particular individual)
 
Gmoney4WW said:
Like I'm going to ignore it if they find it's more widespread. I just don't have suspicions that it is more widespread, until I see evidence. Doesn't matter which party is in power, or which agency has allegations against it.
Click to expand...
The supervisor that was fired recently gave an interview stating that the policy of avoiding homes based on perceived political affiliations was also reduced to writing in NC. Put simply, she said she was a patsy for leadership.

In the interview she suggested Congress request specific documents related to the training and supervision of workers in NC which she says contained similar instructions and were circulated throughout NC.

And there may be legs to it. At the time, the Washington Post reported in October that FEMA and the U.S. Forest discontinued service door to door, their typical method, in large parts of NC after claiming in an email to other government agencies, without evidence or any confirmation from DOD or law enforcement, that National Guard personnel encountered “two army trucks of militia who claimed they were out hunting FEMA.”

Both local and federal law enforcement quickly determined these reports to be false.

FEMA to date has not offered an explanation for the publication of the unconfirmed information later determined to be false. Or why door to door service did not resume.

Local commentators have pointed out that these actions make it less likely for some victims to come forward, further breeds government distrust, and reduces the amount of aid injected into the economy to help the public recover.

Which has the same practical effect of skipping doors.

It will be interesting if Congress remains focused on this issue.

This reminds me of the Obama era DHS blunder where they published that absurd report that said because some extremists are veterans, all veterans may be extremists.
 
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HuffyCane said:
The supervisor that was fired recently gave an interview stating that the policy of avoiding homes based on perceived political affiliations was also reduced to writing in NC. Put simply, she said she was a patsy for leadership.

In the interview she suggested Congress request specific documents related to the training and supervision of workers in NC which she says contained similar instructions and were circulated throughout NC.

And there may be legs to it. At the time, the Washington Post reported in October that FEMA and the U.S. Forest discontinued service door to door, their typical method, in large parts of NC after claiming in an email to other government agencies, without evidence or any confirmation from DOD or law enforcement, that National Guard personnel encountered “two army trucks of militia who claimed they were out hunting FEMA.”

Both local and federal law enforcement quickly determined these reports to be false.

FEMA to date has not offered an explanation for the publication of the unconfirmed information later determined to be false. Or why door to door service did not resume.

Local commentators have pointed out that these actions make it less likely for some victims to come forward, further breeds government distrust, and reduces the amount of aid injected into the economy to help the public recover.

Which has the same practical effect of skipping doors.

It will be interesting if Congress remains focused on this issue.

This reminds me of the Obama era DHS blunder where they published that absurd report that said because some extremists are veterans, all veterans may be extremists.
Click to expand...

This sounds like something that can't be proven , with reports circulating online upon which one side can make claims , but never show proof. You know what that is don't you. I'll wait for Congress to give me a full report.
 
Gmoney4WW said:
This sounds like something that can't be proven , with reports circulating online upon which one side can make claims , but never show proof. You know what that is don't you. I'll wait for Congress to give me a full report.
Click to expand...
Fair. When the Wash Post and the local sheriff dismantle the militia story in minutes, it’s not clickbait. And often a situation resolved short of hearings due to the confidential nature of personnel actions. Congress should persist with inquiries and I hope they do.
 
HuffyCane said:
Fair. When the Wash Post and the local sheriff dismantle the militia story in minutes, it’s not clickbait. And often a situation resolved short of hearings due to the confidential nature of personnel actions. Congress should persist with inquiries and I hope they do.
Click to expand...
Can Congress inquire as to why other Congressmen ransom disaster relief funds in the same manner?
 
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