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Sean Sutton

I’m just sad that in 2022, we are back to seeing people’s skin color before seeing anything else. And this is progress?
“Also important is the Diversity, Equity & Inclusion emphasis the University is taking which would make a candidate like Kim English or David Patrick more appealing.”
That is literally saying because someone is black makes them a better candidate , that’s all I’m against
 
I agree , that’s why I’m saying someone’s skin color should not be a bonus or a negative on how we hire someone, I don’t know how that is racist
The problem I have, obviously, is with your claim that Frank was hired because he was black. Do you say we just hired Woj or JP because they're white? Lol black guys have all the advantages and white guys get nothing? If we're neutral to skin color, why does this claim of racial preference only apply to the black guys? Frank is without question the most accomplished coach we've hired in the last 20+ years, the one where a non-merit factor makes the least sense, but you only apply racial hiring to him? That's race neutral? You look at Frank and you don't see his 31-5 season or any of his other accomplishments, you only see his blackness, it's an all encompassing factor that overwhelms anything else he might have done or accomplished.

The other problem is that you're tokenizing the black coaches. White guys are hired because of merit but black guys (even ones who are highly qualified) are only bc of their race. And then you say we shouldn't hire based on race. So white guys are hired on merit and black guys are hired on race, and we shouldn't hire on race, so the logical conclusion is never to hire a black guy bc no matter what they've accomplished, they're definitionally a race based hire. If you chalk Frank up to racial preferencing, then you'll think that almost any black guys is based on racial preferencnig and shouldn't be hired. I just find it ironic that everything you say separates people by race but then you say don't think about race. I'm not saying you're a white hood racist but I think that you're not anywhere nearly as race neutral as you like to think.
 
The problem I have, obviously, is with your claim that Frank was hired because he was black. Do you say we just hired Woj or JP because they're white? Lol black guys have all the advantages and white guys get nothing? If we're neutral to skin color, why does this claim of racial preference only apply to the black guys? Frank is without question the most accomplished coach we've hired in the last 20+ years, the one where a non-merit factor makes the least sense, but you only apply racial hiring to him? That's race neutral? You look at Frank and you don't see his 31-5 season or any of his other accomplishments, you only see his blackness, it's an all encompassing factor that overwhelms anything else he might have done or accomplished.

The other problem is that you're tokenizing the black coaches. White guys are hired because of merit but black guys (even ones who are highly qualified) are only bc of their race. And then you say we shouldn't hire based on race. So white guys are hired on merit and black guys are hired on race, and we shouldn't hire on race, so the logical conclusion is never to hire a black guy bc no matter what they've accomplished, they're definitionally a race based hire. If you chalk Frank up to racial preferencing, then you'll think that almost any black guys is based on racial preferencnig and shouldn't be hired. I just find it ironic that everything you say separates people by race but then you say don't think about race. I'm not saying you're a white hood racist but I think that you're not anywhere nearly as race neutral as you like to think.
No I see that we have not reached any post tournament play with his players since we have been here , I have no issues that he is black WHATSOEVER. I’m not trying to say that him being black was the only reason we hired him, but I think it may have made him more appealing to Gragg , because of the BLM movement that was popular on campus then . Thr only reason I’m even bringing this up is because it was mentioned it might be “ more appealing” to hire Kim English over Sutton because of “diversity “.
That is what truly is racist IMO . We should hire someone based off of their credibility to coach, not because they are a certain color.
 
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The problem I have, obviously, is with your claim that Frank was hired because he was black. Do you say we just hired Woj or JP because they're white? Lol black guys have all the advantages and white guys get nothing? If we're neutral to skin color, why does this claim of racial preference only apply to the black guys? Frank is without question the most accomplished coach we've hired in the last 20+ years, the one where a non-merit factor makes the least sense, but you only apply racial hiring to him? That's race neutral? You look at Frank and you don't see his 31-5 season or any of his other accomplishments, you only see his blackness, it's an all encompassing factor that overwhelms anything else he might have done or accomplished.

The other problem is that you're tokenizing the black coaches. White guys are hired because of merit but black guys (even ones who are highly qualified) are only bc of their race. And then you say we shouldn't hire based on race. So white guys are hired on merit and black guys are hired on race, and we shouldn't hire on race, so the logical conclusion is never to hire a black guy bc no matter what they've accomplished, they're definitionally a race based hire. If you chalk Frank up to racial preferencing, then you'll think that almost any black guys is based on racial preferencnig and shouldn't be hired. I just find it ironic that everything you say separates people by race but then you say don't think about race. I'm not saying you're a white hood racist but I think that you're not anywhere nearly as race neutral as you like to think.
I never said ANYTHING about hiring a black is not good! It just shouldn’t be the only reason we hire him. Frank has a ton of baggage coming from Miami , and was about to get fired at Missouri , I would have the same issue about a white coach with the same issues .
 
The problem I have, obviously, is with your claim that Frank was hired because he was black. Do you say we just hired Woj or JP because they're white? Lol black guys have all the advantages and white guys get nothing? If we're neutral to skin color, why does this claim of racial preference only apply to the black guys? Frank is without question the most accomplished coach we've hired in the last 20+ years, the one where a non-merit factor makes the least sense, but you only apply racial hiring to him? That's race neutral? You look at Frank and you don't see his 31-5 season or any of his other accomplishments, you only see his blackness, it's an all encompassing factor that overwhelms anything else he might have done or accomplished.

The other problem is that you're tokenizing the black coaches. White guys are hired because of merit but black guys (even ones who are highly qualified) are only bc of their race. And then you say we shouldn't hire based on race. So white guys are hired on merit and black guys are hired on race, and we shouldn't hire on race, so the logical conclusion is never to hire a black guy bc no matter what they've accomplished, they're definitionally a race based hire. If you chalk Frank up to racial preferencing, then you'll think that almost any black guys is based on racial preferencnig and shouldn't be hired. I just find it ironic that everything you say separates people by race but then you say don't think about race. I'm not saying you're a white hood racist but I think that you're not anywhere nearly as race neutral as you like to think.
However , we can end this conversation if you would like and just get back to basketball talk . I’m just stating the fact i am not racist whatsoever , and just want what is best for TU basketball
 
However , we can end this conversation if you would like and just get back to basketball talk . I’m just stating the fact i am not racist whatsoever , and just want what is best for TU basketball
Enough already!!
Now for real excitement we may be able to Get Jwann Howard for cheap!
 
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I literally just said we shouldn’t hire someone just because of their skin color ! How is this racist ?!
If you’re on the right, getting called a racist no matter what you say or do is the norm. You’ll learn to ignore it.
 
If you’re on the right, getting called a racist no matter what you say or do is the norm. You’ll learn to ignore it.
Not really on either side but Unfortunately your right , but you can’t please everyone ! Just have to do what you feel is right
 
The idiots on ESPN are wringing their hands about the Michigan - Wisconsin brawl yesterday. Fine both coaches and be done with it.
 
Couldn't pull off bringing in an most of juco squad like Nolan did. Damn I miss those days of tenacious defense and athleticism on display by players in a Tulsa uniform.
 
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The idiots on ESPN are wringing their hands about the Michigan - Wisconsin brawl yesterday. Fine both coaches and be done with it.
I'll be interested to see how many games they sit Howard for this one. He wasn't reprimanded last season when he went after Turgeon in the Big 10 tourney, because no punches were thrown, but his temper is a problem that seems to be developing into a pattern. It will also be interesting to see what the involvment of the Wisconsin assistant that he took the swipe at.
 
I must have missed this article since I don’t take the TW. I do remember the relationship between Ed and Nolan. I’m sure the Beshara’s could supply him with a few of the polka dot shirts and a few pair of cowboy boots. I would even drive down from the Springfield, MO area to watch Nolan. I love the man and what he did for TU basketball.

I still rate the Nolan era as the highlight of TU basketball, although Bill Self and Tubby Smith were equally important.
I was at the Final Four in Indianapolis in 2000 but had to watch Mich St/Wisc and UNC/Florida instead of TU/Florida. I was almost a part of TU Basketball history. This article is long but an excellent read.

——————
There a few things as tough as carrying someone's casket, especially if that someone was like a father to you.

My "second father" happened to be Nolan Richardson's second father, too. Last week, I served as a pallbearer, and Nolan Richardson delivered the eulogy, when Ed Beshara Sr. of Tulsa was laid to rest. Ed lived a full 91 years and was a father figure to me the last 29. Arkansas basketball fans will remember Ed as the little one-eyed man with the red tam hat sitting in the first row just behind Coach Richardson. He owned the best clothing store in the Midwest. He supplied Nolan with all of those fine silk suits. I spent many a day with Ed. It started in 1978 when Bill Connors, my boss at the Tulsa World, sent me to Ed's shop on south Harvard to pick up a tuxedo for my trip to New York City to cover the Heisman Trophy dinner when Billy Sims won. A few years later, I took over the golf beat at the newspaper and began to cover Ed's charity tournament at Cedar Ridge Country Club. My house was just a few blocks from Ed's, and not much farther from his store. More and more often, Ed would call me to eat lunch or play golf. Then, when Richardson became coach at Arkansas, Ed would ride with me to see the Razorbacks play. When the NCAA Tournament rolled around, Ed usually stayed in my hotel room. He'd introduce me as his son, and I never minded. Ed loved Nolan as a son, too. He "adopted" Nolan when he became head coach at Tulsa in 1981. As a mover and shaker in Tulsa athletics, Ed was sought by some other big boosters to try and oust Nolan because they didn't want a black coach. That backfired as Ed reached out to become Nolan's friend. "He called me to come to his store almost every day for several weeks," Nolan said in his eulogy at Ed's funeral. "I walked in and he said, 'How you doing, Hoss?' I knew I was going to like this man. That's what my grandfather used to call people. Ed told me he was going to be my guardian angel." The funeral mass for Ed at St. Mary's Church was perfect. An opera singer performed the music Ed had chosen for his service. Nolan delivered a stirring message about his best friend. It was a tough day but special, too. One of the things I hold close to my heart are the many times Ed told me that he loved me and kissed my cheek. You just don't get that from grown men. He said it was "old country stuff." I always knew he meant it. Another thing I will never forget is the way he treated the word 'hate.' It was the worst of four-letter words to him. If you were eating lunch and there were vegetables on your plate that you didn't care for, if you said,"I hate peas," he took that as an opportunity to preach. "Don't ever say hate, my son," Ed would say. "Don't hate anything. Don't hate things and don't hate people. Don't even use that word." As Nolan said in his eulogy, if more people felt that way, there would be no wars, no arguments. The world would be a better place. I believe that, too. It was a tough day for Nolan for several reasons. Obviously, he considered Ed Beshara his absolute best friend. He said Ed did something his father didn't do on a regular basis. "I lost my father and grandfather when I was 12," Nolan said. "Then I got to Tulsa and Ed adopted me. He kissed me and told me he loved me every time we saw each other. I needed that. I hadn't had it for so long." But there was another reason it was tough for Nolan. The funeral for his daughter, Yvonne, was in the same church on May 1, 1987. "It was 20 years ago to the day that we had Yvonne's funeral here," Nolan said. "Ed made all the arrangements for that service. That shows you how close and dear he is to me." Ed wasn't perfect. He'd tell you about his vices. He gambled hard, and he cussed often. But he provided so many lessons in life and he made sure that you listened. It served you well to listen. Nolan cried as he finished his remarks. He said he promised Ed that he would not cry at his funeral, but he said he could not hold back the tears. Sometimes it's good to cry. The memories that Ed left with me are wonderful. I've had fun sharing some of the stories this week.
 
I must have missed this article since I don’t take the TW. I do remember the relationship between Ed and Nolan. I’m sure the Beshara’s could supply him with a few of the polka dot shirts and a few pair of cowboy boots. I would even drive down from the Springfield, MO area to watch Nolan. I love the man and what he did for TU basketball.

I still rate the Nolan era as the highlight of TU basketball, although Bill Self and Tubby Smith were equally important.
I was at the Final Four in Indianapolis in 2000 but had to watch Mich St/Wisc and UNC/Florida instead of TU/Florida. I was almost a part of TU Basketball history. This article is long but an excellent read.

——————
There a few things as tough as carrying someone's casket, especially if that someone was like a father to you.

My "second father" happened to be Nolan Richardson's second father, too. Last week, I served as a pallbearer, and Nolan Richardson delivered the eulogy, when Ed Beshara Sr. of Tulsa was laid to rest. Ed lived a full 91 years and was a father figure to me the last 29. Arkansas basketball fans will remember Ed as the little one-eyed man with the red tam hat sitting in the first row just behind Coach Richardson. He owned the best clothing store in the Midwest. He supplied Nolan with all of those fine silk suits. I spent many a day with Ed. It started in 1978 when Bill Connors, my boss at the Tulsa World, sent me to Ed's shop on south Harvard to pick up a tuxedo for my trip to New York City to cover the Heisman Trophy dinner when Billy Sims won. A few years later, I took over the golf beat at the newspaper and began to cover Ed's charity tournament at Cedar Ridge Country Club. My house was just a few blocks from Ed's, and not much farther from his store. More and more often, Ed would call me to eat lunch or play golf. Then, when Richardson became coach at Arkansas, Ed would ride with me to see the Razorbacks play. When the NCAA Tournament rolled around, Ed usually stayed in my hotel room. He'd introduce me as his son, and I never minded. Ed loved Nolan as a son, too. He "adopted" Nolan when he became head coach at Tulsa in 1981. As a mover and shaker in Tulsa athletics, Ed was sought by some other big boosters to try and oust Nolan because they didn't want a black coach. That backfired as Ed reached out to become Nolan's friend. "He called me to come to his store almost every day for several weeks," Nolan said in his eulogy at Ed's funeral. "I walked in and he said, 'How you doing, Hoss?' I knew I was going to like this man. That's what my grandfather used to call people. Ed told me he was going to be my guardian angel." The funeral mass for Ed at St. Mary's Church was perfect. An opera singer performed the music Ed had chosen for his service. Nolan delivered a stirring message about his best friend. It was a tough day but special, too. One of the things I hold close to my heart are the many times Ed told me that he loved me and kissed my cheek. You just don't get that from grown men. He said it was "old country stuff." I always knew he meant it. Another thing I will never forget is the way he treated the word 'hate.' It was the worst of four-letter words to him. If you were eating lunch and there were vegetables on your plate that you didn't care for, if you said,"I hate peas," he took that as an opportunity to preach. "Don't ever say hate, my son," Ed would say. "Don't hate anything. Don't hate things and don't hate people. Don't even use that word." As Nolan said in his eulogy, if more people felt that way, there would be no wars, no arguments. The world would be a better place. I believe that, too. It was a tough day for Nolan for several reasons. Obviously, he considered Ed Beshara his absolute best friend. He said Ed did something his father didn't do on a regular basis. "I lost my father and grandfather when I was 12," Nolan said. "Then I got to Tulsa and Ed adopted me. He kissed me and told me he loved me every time we saw each other. I needed that. I hadn't had it for so long." But there was another reason it was tough for Nolan. The funeral for his daughter, Yvonne, was in the same church on May 1, 1987. "It was 20 years ago to the day that we had Yvonne's funeral here," Nolan said. "Ed made all the arrangements for that service. That shows you how close and dear he is to me." Ed wasn't perfect. He'd tell you about his vices. He gambled hard, and he cussed often. But he provided so many lessons in life and he made sure that you listened. It served you well to listen. Nolan cried as he finished his remarks. He said he promised Ed that he would not cry at his funeral, but he said he could not hold back the tears. Sometimes it's good to cry. The memories that Ed left with me are wonderful. I've had fun sharing some of the stories this week.

Might have to go to the grandkids, as his daughter Margo just passed away recently.
 
Really? The man can recruit and straight up coach. Also, it would be an instant boost of support which is exactly what TU needs right now.

I’d really like to know why you think that?
He can coach for sure. I don't think that's really the issue. And I'm all for 2nd chances if he is rehabilitated and still attending regular meetings for that accountability. My biggest question is can he recruit to TU? Does he have the energy needed for an overhaul and rebuild? I would guess he's around 54-55 right? Age is not a barrier IMO either way, but it could affect his energy to the position and is he really looking for that?
 
I'll be interested to see how many games they sit Howard for this one. He wasn't reprimanded last season when he went after Turgeon in the Big 10 tourney, because no punches were thrown, but his temper is a problem that seems to be developing into a pattern. It will also be interesting to see what the involvment of the Wisconsin assistant that he took the swipe at.
I saw a new look at the incident. Howard repeatedly kept telling Greg Gard to "don't ****ing touch me. Don't ****ing touch me. Don't touch me" and Gard wouldn't let it go. Then Howard wagged the Mutombo finger in his face and that really sparked things off. The Wisconsin assistant came in and said something (inadible) and you saw Howard's eyes widen sort of like that moment when Billy Clanton reacted to Doc Holliday winking at him in Tombstone. Whatever was said didn't go over well.
 
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Don’t think he gets fired either although throwing a punch (or slap) at another coach is grounds. Likely suspended for the rest of the year would be my guess. Being an alum probably saves his job. Just can’t do that crap.
 
The Wisconsin assistant came in and said something (inadible) and you saw Howard's eyes widen sort of like that moment when Billy Clanton reacted to Doc Holliday winking at him in Tombstone. Whatever was said didn't go over well.
Isn’t that a daisy.
 
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I’m just sad that in 2022, we are back to seeing people’s skin color before seeing anything else. And this is progress?
But we can't be and are not. Though I agree there are some forces in society that suggest this can be just to address past injustice.

Not a prevailing view though imo.
 
I must have missed this article since I don’t take the TW. I do remember the relationship between Ed and Nolan. I’m sure the Beshara’s could supply him with a few of the polka dot shirts and a few pair of cowboy boots. I would even drive down from the Springfield, MO area to watch Nolan. I love the man and what he did for TU basketball.

I still rate the Nolan era as the highlight of TU basketball, although Bill Self and Tubby Smith were equally important.
I was at the Final Four in Indianapolis in 2000 but had to watch Mich St/Wisc and UNC/Florida instead of TU/Florida. I was almost a part of TU Basketball history. This article is long but an excellent read.

——————
There a few things as tough as carrying someone's casket, especially if that someone was like a father to you.

My "second father" happened to be Nolan Richardson's second father, too. Last week, I served as a pallbearer, and Nolan Richardson delivered the eulogy, when Ed Beshara Sr. of Tulsa was laid to rest. Ed lived a full 91 years and was a father figure to me the last 29. Arkansas basketball fans will remember Ed as the little one-eyed man with the red tam hat sitting in the first row just behind Coach Richardson. He owned the best clothing store in the Midwest. He supplied Nolan with all of those fine silk suits. I spent many a day with Ed. It started in 1978 when Bill Connors, my boss at the Tulsa World, sent me to Ed's shop on south Harvard to pick up a tuxedo for my trip to New York City to cover the Heisman Trophy dinner when Billy Sims won. A few years later, I took over the golf beat at the newspaper and began to cover Ed's charity tournament at Cedar Ridge Country Club. My house was just a few blocks from Ed's, and not much farther from his store. More and more often, Ed would call me to eat lunch or play golf. Then, when Richardson became coach at Arkansas, Ed would ride with me to see the Razorbacks play. When the NCAA Tournament rolled around, Ed usually stayed in my hotel room. He'd introduce me as his son, and I never minded. Ed loved Nolan as a son, too. He "adopted" Nolan when he became head coach at Tulsa in 1981. As a mover and shaker in Tulsa athletics, Ed was sought by some other big boosters to try and oust Nolan because they didn't want a black coach. That backfired as Ed reached out to become Nolan's friend. "He called me to come to his store almost every day for several weeks," Nolan said in his eulogy at Ed's funeral. "I walked in and he said, 'How you doing, Hoss?' I knew I was going to like this man. That's what my grandfather used to call people. Ed told me he was going to be my guardian angel." The funeral mass for Ed at St. Mary's Church was perfect. An opera singer performed the music Ed had chosen for his service. Nolan delivered a stirring message about his best friend. It was a tough day but special, too. One of the things I hold close to my heart are the many times Ed told me that he loved me and kissed my cheek. You just don't get that from grown men. He said it was "old country stuff." I always knew he meant it. Another thing I will never forget is the way he treated the word 'hate.' It was the worst of four-letter words to him. If you were eating lunch and there were vegetables on your plate that you didn't care for, if you said,"I hate peas," he took that as an opportunity to preach. "Don't ever say hate, my son," Ed would say. "Don't hate anything. Don't hate things and don't hate people. Don't even use that word." As Nolan said in his eulogy, if more people felt that way, there would be no wars, no arguments. The world would be a better place. I believe that, too. It was a tough day for Nolan for several reasons. Obviously, he considered Ed Beshara his absolute best friend. He said Ed did something his father didn't do on a regular basis. "I lost my father and grandfather when I was 12," Nolan said. "Then I got to Tulsa and Ed adopted me. He kissed me and told me he loved me every time we saw each other. I needed that. I hadn't had it for so long." But there was another reason it was tough for Nolan. The funeral for his daughter, Yvonne, was in the same church on May 1, 1987. "It was 20 years ago to the day that we had Yvonne's funeral here," Nolan said. "Ed made all the arrangements for that service. That shows you how close and dear he is to me." Ed wasn't perfect. He'd tell you about his vices. He gambled hard, and he cussed often. But he provided so many lessons in life and he made sure that you listened. It served you well to listen. Nolan cried as he finished his remarks. He said he promised Ed that he would not cry at his funeral, but he said he could not hold back the tears. Sometimes it's good to cry. The memories that Ed left with me are wonderful. I've had fun sharing some of the stories this week.
Ed and my dad were friends with both being part of the Lebanese American community and even originating from neighboring villages in Mount Lebanon overlooking Beirut. I remember Ed well.
 
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i'd be willing to give Sutton a chance. Maybe a 3 year "do or you're done" deal. Can't be any worse than what we have now.
 
i'd be willing to give Sutton a chance. Maybe a 3 year "do or you're done" deal. Can't be any worse than what we have now.
That’s what I’m thinking. I really believe someone is going to benefit from hiring Sean or Billy Gillespie. There was a great ESPN article on Billy Clyde today as a matter of fact. These guys will ALWAYS know basketball, it’s just a matter of who’s going to give them another opportunity. I hope it’s us.
 
That’s what I’m thinking. I really believe someone is going to benefit from hiring Sean or Billy Gillespie. There was a great ESPN article on Billy Clyde today as a matter of fact. These guys will ALWAYS know basketball, it’s just a matter of who’s going to give them another opportunity. I hope it’s us.
Would prefer Billy.
 
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TU is not the kind of program to rehab a coach unless they were very successful at a previous stop. Neither Sutton or Billy Clyde fits that bill. (Maybe the Sean from Arizona fame!)
For me either a seasoned guy with baggage, or a young up and comer is what will bring us the best chance to reload.
Yes Sutton may sell some tickets to start but what makes him a great recruiter. Billy Clyde getting up there in age and may not have the same ability to relate.
I am still wanting an up and coming young guy that has the personality to connect with the current High School players we need to quickly build a program.
 
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