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Sean Sutton

TUFan1981

TUFan1981

I.T.S. Junior
Apr 27, 2006
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Should be the next head coach at TU if Frank is let go.

I think this is an unbelievable fit and he would take the job.

Let’s see, he learned from one of the greatest to ever blow a whistle and has supplemented that knowledge with nuggets from Chris Beard and Mark Adams.

I know some won’t like it because of his past, but that was 20 years ago and he is rehabilitated.

IMO, this needs to happen. Anyone else on board?
 
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Really? The man can recruit and straight up coach. Also, it would be an instant boost of support which is exactly what TU needs right now.

I’d really like to know why you think that?
 
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Well, I’ve got news for you…he’ll be at the top of the list. He may or may not get the job, but he’s going to be seriously considered.
 
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I don't mind if he is interviewed. Good coach and recruiter and wants to show he can win. But does he have the charisma it takes to woo fans back? Also important is the Diversity, Equity & Inclusion emphasis the University is taking which would make a candidate like Kim English or David Patrick more appealing.
 
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I.I. said:
I don't mind if he is interviewed. Good coach and recruiter and wants to show he can win. But does he have the charisma it takes to woo fans back? Also important is the Diversity, Equity & Inclusion emphasis the University is taking which would make a candidate like Kim English or David Patrick more appealing.
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Good points for sure.
 
I.I. said:
I don't mind if he is interviewed. Good coach and recruiter and wants to show he can win. But does he have the charisma it takes to woo fans back? Also important is the Diversity, Equity & Inclusion emphasis the University is taking which would make a candidate like Kim English or David Patrick more appealing.
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I’m starting to think that is why Gragg hired Frank Haith , we should never hire someone because of the color of their skin . I don’t care what color someone’s skin is, just if he can do the job.
 
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TULSARISING said:
I’m starting to think that is why Gragg hired Frank Haith , we should never hire someone because of the color of their skin . I don’t care what color someone’s skin is, just if he can do the job.
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If that were the case he probably wouldn’t have fired the Native American football coach and replaced him with a white one. Gragg sucked for a variety of reasons but he didn’t hire Frank because he’s black
 
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URedskin54 said:
If that were the case he probably wouldn’t have fired the Native American football coach and replaced him with a white one. Gragg sucked for a variety of reasons but he didn’t hire Frank because he’s black
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My point was that we shouldn’t be hiring coaches just so we are “ diverse “. IMO ( take it for what it’s worth ) I think he had a chance to hire Frank , who was being ran out of Missouri , to uphold the diverse culture that was starting to pop up at the university. We need to hire the coach that is going to turn us into a winning program. It does not matter that the color of someone’s skin or background is and should have nothing to do with the hire
 
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Why the love for Sean? Had one decent year as head coach at OSU (with Eddies team) and only a 54% overall record. Interesting that Beard did not take him to Texas as an assistant and now he is an advisory and director of player development still at Tech. (Kind of a low level position and probably not a off campus recruiter.)
I understand his connection to Tulsa but I really believe we could do much better!
Why do you think he will he will be so highly considered? Who has this connection to the Sutton family?
 
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TULSARISING said:
My point was that we shouldn’t be hiring coaches just so we are “ diverse “. IMO ( take it for what it’s worth ) I think he had a chance to hire Frank , who was being ran out of Missouri , to uphold the diverse culture that was starting to pop up at the university. We need to hire the coach that is going to turn us into a winning program. It does not matter that the color of someone’s skin or background is and should have nothing to do with the hire
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This is stupid. Gragg had the chance to hire a guy who was 31-5 two years before in the Big 12 and to put TU in the national spotlight by taking a coach from a Big 12 school. It was a high risk, high reward hire. If color of skin is the only reason you can only think of for why he hired Grank, then you're an idiot and a ... Well, never mind. You see boogeymen everytime there's a bump in the night because of the way you see the world, not because there are boogeymen there.
 
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chito_and_leon said:
This is stupid. Gragg had the chance to hire a guy who was 31-5 two years before in the Big 12 and to put TU in the national spotlight by taking a coach from a Big 12 school. It was a high risk, high reward hire. If color of skin is the only reason you can only think of for why he hired Grank, then you're an idiot and a ... Well, never mind. You see boogeymen everytime there's a bump in the night because of the way you see the world, not because there are boogeymen there.
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He was being ran off from Missouri , it was a stupid hire from the beginning, and it’s being proven now how stupid of a hire it was , he has never had consistent success. He always leaves a place worse then what it was , just like Gragg. And what proof would you have to make an assumption I’m a racist ? I literally said nobody should be hired because of the color of their skin.
 
TULSARISING said:
I’m starting to think that is why Gragg hired Frank Haith , we should never hire someone because of the color of their skin . I don’t care what color someone’s skin is, just if he can do the job.
Click to expand...
You talk about it like there's an absolute list of best to worst hires that everyone knows, #1 - #500. But it doesn't work that way. Who's the "best" depends entirely on who you ask. "Great" hires go south and random guys from a little JC in Texas or a random pro QB coach turn out to be fantastic. You get a list of probably 50 guys who are generally qualified and the "best" guy on that list is entirely, 100% subjective. So stop with the nonsense about making the "best" hire, there's no way to know who that is until after the fact. Do the names Keith Burns, Dave Wojick, Phillip Montogermy ring a bell. Are you complaining that they just got hired because they're white? We screw up with lots of white guy hires and nobody complains about race but we screw up with a black guy hire and suddenly it's all about race. SMH.
 
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chito_and_leon said:
This is stupid. Gragg had the chance to hire a guy who was 31-5 two years before in the Big 12 and to put TU in the national spotlight by taking a coach from a Big 12 school. It was a high risk, high reward hire. If color of skin is the only reason you can only think of for why he hired Grank, then you're an idiot and a ... Well, never mind. You see boogeymen everytime there's a bump in the night because of the way you see the world, not because there are boogeymen there.
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And as dumb as TU has ran things the past decade, it wouldn’t surprise me that it was A deciding factor on why to hire him
 
TULSARISING said:
He was being ran off from Missouri , it was a stupid hire from the beginning, and it’s being proven now how stupid of a hire it was , he has never had consistent success. He always leaves a place worse then what it was , just like Gragg. And what proof would you have to make an assumption I’m a racist ? I literally said nobody should be hired because of the color of their skin.
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He was successful everywhere he went. He was 31-5 two yeas before. This was not an irrational hire, we were bringing him to a lower level conference. Did I love the hire? No. Do I see the rationale? Yeah, absolutely. It was a high risk, high reward hire. If he recreated his success at Missouri and Miami, it would have really put TU back on the map. It didn't work out, but I think the far likley more explanation was that Gragg just wasn't good at his job than that Frank was hired because of race. He was hired because of his success at top tier schools, not because of his race.
 
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chito_and_leon said:
You talk about it like there's an absolute list of best to worst hires that everyone knows, #1 - #500. But it doesn't work that way. Who's the "best" depends entirely on who you ask. "Great" hires go south and random guys from a little JC in Texas or a random pro QB coach turn out to be fantastic. You get a list of probably 50 guys who are generally qualified and the "best" guy on that list is entirely, 100% subjective. So stop with the nonsense about making the "best" hire, there's no way to know who that is until after the fact. Do the names Keith Burns, Dave Wojick, Phillip Montogermy ring a bell. Are you complaining that they just got hired because they're white? We screw up with lots of white guy hires and nobody complains about race but we screw up with a black guy hire and suddenly it's all about race. SMH.
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If you would have read the whole thread , you would see that’s not what this is about . Someone made a comment about how Sutton may not like the whole diversity with coaching TU was trying to have and I said that the color of someone’s skin shouldn’t be a deciding factor on why some should be considered
 
TULSARISING said:
And as dumb as TU has ran things the past decade, it wouldn’t surprise me that it was A deciding factor on why to hire him
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Please. We kept him because it cost too much to fire him, same with Monty, not because of his race. Did we keep Frank because he's black and Monty because he's white? Let's be honest about how we're dumb rather than inventing race arguments.
 
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chito_and_leon said:
He was successful everywhere he went. He was 31-5 two yeas before. This was not an irrational hire, we were bringing him to a lower level conference. Did I love the hire? No. Do I see the rationale? Yeah, absolutely. It was a high risk, high reward hire. If he recreated his success at Missouri and Miami, it would have really put TU back on the map. It didn't work out, but I think the far likley more explanation was that Gragg just wasn't good at his job than that Frank was hired because of race. He was hired because of his success at top tier schools, not because of his race.
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He had some success in the beginning and always brought the programs down after he had been there
chito_and_leon said:
Please. We kept him because it cost too much to fire him, same with Monty, not because of his race. Did we keep Frank because he's black and Monty because he's white? Let's be honest about how we're dumb rather than inventing race arguments.
Click to expand...
chito_and_leon said:
Please. We kept him because it cost too much to fire him, same with Monty, not because of his race. Did we keep Frank because he's black and Monty because he's white? Let's be honest about how we're dumb rather than inventing race arguments.
Click to expand...
chito_and_leon said:
Please. We kept him because it cost too much to fire him, same with Monty, not because of his race. Did we keep Frank because he's black and Monty because he's white? Let's be honest about how we're dumb rather than inventing race arguments.
Click to expand...
Please read the whole thread before you keep trying to call me a racist
 
TULSARISING said:
If you would have read the whole thread , you would see that’s not what this is about . Someone made a comment about how Sutton may not like the whole diversity with coaching TU was trying to have and I said that the color of someone’s skin shouldn’t be a deciding factor on why some should be considered
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I think we would have hired Frank if he had been white. Would we have hired Monty if he were black? And if so, would we would now be saying that we hired Monty because he was black? We hired Monty, and Frank, because we're really bad at selecting coaches. Look back at our track record of hires in the last 20 years. Black, white, purple, we're just really bad at it. Let's not make some excuse about race when the real problem is that we can't hire good coaches.
 
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chito_and_leon said:
I think we would have hired Frank if he had been white. Would we have hired Monty if he were black? And if so, would we would now be saying that we hired Monty because he was black? We hired Monty, and Frank, because we're really bad at selecting coaches. Look back at our track record of hires in the last 20 years. Black, white, purple, we're just really bad at it. Let's not make some excuse about race when the real problem is that we can't hire good coaches.
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I understand what you are saying , I’m not a racist. I was just simply trying to say we don’t need to hire coaches to be “ diverse”
 
chito_and_leon said:
I think we would have hired Frank if he had been white. Would we have hired Monty if he were black? And if so, would we would now be saying that we hired Monty because he was black? We hired Monty, and Frank, because we're really bad at selecting coaches. Look back at our track record of hires in the last 20 years. Black, white, purple, we're just really bad at it. Let's not make some excuse about race when the real problem is that we can't hire good coaches.
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Going back to 2000. Hiring by race is not our problem.
Buzz Peterson, D+ hire, white
John Phillips, F hire, white
Doug Wojick, C hire, white
Danny Manning, B- hire, black
Frank Haith, C- hire, black.
 
chito_and_leon said:
Going back to 2000. Hiring by race is not our problem.
Buzz Peterson, D+ hire, white
John Phillips, F hire, white
Doug Wojick, C hire, white
Danny Manning, B- hire, black
Frank Haith, C- hire, black.
Click to expand...
Like I said , please read the whole thread , never did I say anything about it being bad about hiring a coach because he was black or white , I said that it should not be a deciding factor so we can say we are “ diverse”
 
TULSARISING said:
I understand what you are saying , I’m not a racist. I was just simply trying to say we don’t need to hire coaches to be “ diverse”
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My point is that with where we are, we won't have a slam dunk guy. Anybody we hire is going to have some issues. So you get your final 10. One is a devout Christian, one is black, one has 3 kids, another isn't married, one will be photogenic, one will be ugly..... You have a bunch of guys who have a 30% chance of being successful and you pick based on other random things. But we only call out one of those other random things to get worked up about. I'd never say that we just hired Monty because he's a Christian or married or whatever even though those things probably play a role. Figure out why we hire bad coaches and focus on the real things because we miss on a bunch of white coaches as well as black and whatever criteria unrelated to race that we use are far from right.
 
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chito_and_leon said:
Going back to 2000. Hiring by race is not our problem.
Buzz Peterson, D+ hire, white
John Phillips, F hire, white
Doug Wojick, C hire, white
Danny Manning, B- hire, black
Frank Haith, C- hire, black.
Click to expand...
Btw , this is how bad rumors get started about someone being a “ racist” I have never viewed someone more or less because of the color of their skin and never would
 
chito_and_leon said:
My point is that with where we are, we won't have a slam dunk guy. Anybody we hire is going to have some issues. So you get your final 10. One is a devout Christian, one is black, one has 3 kids, another isn't married, one will be photogenic, one will be ugly..... You have a bunch of guys who have a 30% chance of being successful and you pick based on other random things. But we only call out one of those other random things to get worked up about. I'd never say that we just hired Monty because he's a Christian or married or whatever even though those things probably play a role. Figure out why we hire bad coaches and focus on the real things because we miss on a bunch of white coaches as well as black and whatever criteria unrelated to race that we use are far from right.
Click to expand...
Fair enough , I’m just wanting to make it my point that I’m not against hiring someone from any certain race, just that it should not be our prime objective
 
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chito_and_leon said:
Please. We kept him because it cost too much to fire him, same with Monty, not because of his race. Did we keep Frank because he's black and Monty because he's white? Let's be honest about how we're dumb rather than inventing race arguments.
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“Also important is the Diversity, Equity & Inclusion emphasis the University is taking which would make a candidate like Kim English or David Patrick more appealing.”

That is what I was responding too, and that’s why I feel Frank may have stood out more as a candidate . This is why I was saying we shouldn’t hire someone just because of the color of their skin .
 
TULSARISING said:
“Also important is the Diversity, Equity & Inclusion emphasis the University is taking which would make a candidate like Kim English or David Patrick more appealing.”

That is what I was responding too, and that’s why I feel Frank may have stood out more as a candidate . This is why I was saying we shouldn’t hire someone just because of the color of their skin .
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If you have a bunch of people who grade out the same and have the same chance of succeeding as best you can tell, you have to decide on something. Is it better to break the tie and pick someone b/c they're a Christian or was in the same fraternity or has a recommendation from Michael Jordan or Tom Izzo? The tie is going to get broken based on some factor that has no relationship with coaching success so why do we care about that factor but not the myriad other unrelated factors that get used to break the tie? In the case of Frank, there are very obvious non-race reasons that he was hired. Based on our hiring history, I'd say that picking someone based on race should be the least of your concerns. We're literally hitting 0.000 for the last 20+ years of BB hiring and not b/c of hiring by race. It's literally impossible for picking by race to be worse than our current approach - I mean, you can't get worse than 0%. Flip a coin, say eeny meeny miny moe, pick based on shoe size. How can it be worse??
 
t-townpod said:
Why the love for Sean? Had one decent year as head coach at OSU (with Eddies team) and only a 54% overall record. Interesting that Beard did not take him to Texas as an assistant and now he is an advisory and director of player development still at Tech. (Kind of a low level position and probably not a off campus recruiter.)
I understand his connection to Tulsa but I really believe we could do much better!
Why do you think he will he will be so highly considered? Who has this connection to the Sutton family?
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I have no connection, I just think it’s quite logical that he would be considered. I believe he is the top assistant at Tech and that’s why he didn’t go to Texas (I could be wrong about that, but that’s what I thought). I think TU needs a shot in the arm right now, a jolt if you will. I don’t know for sure if Sean brings that, but I’m certain he’ll bring fans back into the Reynolds Center as he is well liked in this state and particularly in Tulsa. Look, there may be better hires, but I also believe you could do MUCH worse.
 
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If they decide to remove Frnak, it is highly unlikely that Sean will be considered as a replacement. I predict someone will be picked who we will not immediately recognize, but be happy with down the road because of success.
 
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Henry Kendall said:
I’m just sad that in 2022, we are back to seeing people’s skin color before seeing anything else. And this is progress?
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I agree , that’s why I’m saying someone’s skin color should not be a bonus or a negative on how we hire someone, I don’t know how that is racist
 
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