Democratic Debate
- Thread starter TULSARISING
- Start date
Most spoken word is “free” and not one of them appear to understand the meaning of the same 
Second most frequently used term “climate change” and not one of them understands there is absolutely nothing the US can do to keep the world under the stated drop dead emissions number. Yet spending trillions and raising energy costs and inflation appear to be their only plan.
Second most frequently used term “climate change” and not one of them understands there is absolutely nothing the US can do to keep the world under the stated drop dead emissions number. Yet spending trillions and raising energy costs and inflation appear to be their only plan.
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CNN doing...well...CNN things. They still hate Bernie apparently
Does anyone really think that Bernie wouldn't have said that? I'm not even sure I disagree with Bernie to be honest. But it's not something you should say to a woman who could be looking at a run for the white house.
I'm really tired of the Bernie bro wing of the Democratic party. They're essentially the kids who smoked pot instead of going to class, but they would tell you all about how the world should run.
I'm really tired of the Bernie bro wing of the Democratic party. They're essentially the kids who smoked pot instead of going to class, but they would tell you all about how the world should run.
Bernie’s people don’t appear to be happy with CNN.....again.
https://theintercept.com/2020/01/15/bernie-sanders-cnn-iowa-debate/
https://theintercept.com/2020/01/15/bernie-sanders-cnn-iowa-debate/
Bernie v Warren
I'm no fan of either of them but
Bernie is famous for being intensely left wing.
Warren is famous for being left wing and a liar.
Warren is a Native American. By her own test one/1024th. and using the claim hand written on a job application. She is famous for details her medical plan simply not adding up.
Might Bernie have said that? Perhaps, but he claims not to have. So it comes down to his word against a serial liar who has not made any such claim until recently. And the winner may well be Biden.
I'm no fan of either of them but
Bernie is famous for being intensely left wing.
Warren is famous for being left wing and a liar.
Warren is a Native American. By her own test one/1024th. and using the claim hand written on a job application. She is famous for details her medical plan simply not adding up.
Might Bernie have said that? Perhaps, but he claims not to have. So it comes down to his word against a serial liar who has not made any such claim until recently. And the winner may well be Biden.
As in 2016 the Democratic power brokers don’t want Bernie as the nominee. CNN is basically the media arm of the DNC. This time around they’ve switched tactics from giving their candidate the debate questions beforehand to outright hostility toward Bernie. I’m not a Bernie fan but I do understand his frustration. To my knowledge he’s always been a fairly honest guy...unlike Warren. CNN called him a liar last night and chose to side with a known fraud. Interesting strategy from a media network and debate host.
As for the "he said she said", I have no clue if he said it. I do know he has more credibility than Warren imo. I also know the timing looks suspicious. Warren makes the accusation at a time where Sanders has clearly passed her in the polls. Her candidacy is on life support. She makes the charge not only to back into the media headlines with the likes of CNN champion her narrative but harms her biggest competition on the far left.
As for the "he said she said", I have no clue if he said it. I do know he has more credibility than Warren imo. I also know the timing looks suspicious. Warren makes the accusation at a time where Sanders has clearly passed her in the polls. Her candidacy is on life support. She makes the charge not only to back into the media headlines with the likes of CNN champion her narrative but harms her biggest competition on the far left.
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Lol. The Bernie love is funny. His policy positions are farther afield than Warren. I agree that the powers that be don’t want him to win just like they didn’t want him to win in 2016 because they know he’s way too far left to win a general election.
No Bernie love. It is a three horse race. Iowa is just, well, Iowa.
My highly uneducated guess is that when the convention gets here Biden will get the nod. We might even see the now rare instance of a second ballot. Unless there is a major change, Biden stands the best chance against Trump.
My highly uneducated guess is that when the convention gets here Biden will get the nod. We might even see the now rare instance of a second ballot. Unless there is a major change, Biden stands the best chance against Trump.
Biden is just laying low and watching the clown show. Takes the focus off him while CNN plays up the Bernie - Liz feud. Joe couldn’t ask for anything better.
What's interesting is the generational divide. Now that boomers have aged into their 60's and above, Bernie looks far left and Biden the safe Dem choice. For my children and their friends in their 30's, they see the world in much the same way Bernie and Warren do. Climate change is real, corporate socialism is rampant, real wages are stagnating, the ranks of the poor growing, xenophobia is a pernicious disease, and they are being stuck with the huge pollution and debt load that Trump and Republicans are running up. They don't see Biden as a solution and are impatient with middle of the road strategies. IOW a wide divide that may play into Trump's favor in the short run, but when the next generation takes over, watch out.
No future generation if going to call boomers the 'greatest generation".
No future generation if going to call boomers the 'greatest generation".
There were 100 cases of perjury today. All swore and signed to be unbiased in the Impeachment trial. By some strange twist of fate all will vote by party or by politics of the state that they live in.
I tend to agree, however; during the middling years, there is sometimes change. The youth of the late 60's and 70's changed a lot of policy and practice of the previous eras.
You think that none of the Democrats will vote against Trump simply because they believe he acted inappropriately?
I would be very surprised if the vote isn’t along party lines with a few outliers if the Senator represents a state from another color. The vote would be reversed if a Dem were in the White House. Without a smoking gun this vote will be determined by politics.
Actually, I can't read other peoples mind and don't have the ability of knowing why either party acts the way they do. :O It would be interesting to see how all 100 would vote secretly. But then it wouldn't be secretly.
My comment was just to see which mullet I would reel in first.
I don't disagree that it will follow party lines, but that doesn't mean that the people representing one party or the other don't actually believe what they're voting.
I wouldn't call them all liars for voting along party lines. Only if they vote opposite to issues that they've openly opposed or promoted in the past.
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Agree. I would suggest the vote shows how partisanship and trying to please your constituency dictates in large part the way our leaders vote. This concept isn’t limited to the impeachment proceeding btw. We could have a long debate as to whether politicians should vote in a manner which insures they get re-elected.
I would be happy if they had a secret ballot, and released the results 10 or 15 years from now.
Im 35. Im conservative. I don't like trump but i hate socialism. I have a 401k and im happy about the stock market. Id be ok with Biden but never Warren or Sanders. The climate is changing but we didnt destroy it and throwing money to aoc or Bernie wont fix it either. My 70 yo dad is convinced the world is ending however. So we live in opposite world.
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We have a representative democracy. Actually, it is a mixture of what the people want, an interpretation by Representative of the effect a vote will have, and what is good for the politician. It is worth noting that the lower body is called the House of Representatives, yet most people call them Congressmen/Congresswomen. I'm not sure there is anything wrong with a Representative voting for what the people they represent want unless it violates someone's human rights. Both parties call it "The People's House" then engage in whip votes.
Secret Ballot would be superior although you lose some accountability if you find out the Senators were bribed somehow.
The best candidate for the dems would be any host from CNN or msnbc. They know everything and are always right
If this plays out as everyone predicts, the legitimacy of impeachment process will be forever damaged as will respect for the Senate's integrity. McConnell has already undermined respect for the Senate and Republicans which will inevitably come back to bite when the Dems take control eventually. Maybe some of us won't be around when it happens, but it's another burden (along with massive debt, unhealthy air and water, etc.) my generation is laying off on our kids and grandkids.
There is zero chance future generations will ever refer to Boomers as "the greatest generation".
There is zero chance future generations will ever refer to Boomers as "the greatest generation".
Media keep complaining the process wont work because the Senate Republicans already have their minds made up and wont vote to impeach. They fail to recognize the fact that House democrats had their mind made up and would only vote to impeach.
At least Dems have attempted to gather evidence and present it only to be blocked by the WH. GOP is not providing any defense outside of "asking another country to do a favor is not a crime". I'll grant that as a defense IF and only IF the request has a direct impact on the national security or trade for the US. The case being presented clearly indicates the motive was a personal one to smear a political rival...which would violate the Constitution that the executive branch shall not personally benefit from the office of President. The tactic is very Soviet Union/Putin/Communist China like. You can argue it's not a crime...that's fine. There are arguments both sides on that. There is no denying (and not even the GOP is denying) that Trump made that request of Zelensky. Mick Mulvaney admitted to it during a press briefing that it happened and it happens all the time...its part of politics (paraphrasing what Mulvaney said). Sondland and Vindland both said this request was made. Vindland is career military with a purple heart and solid service record. Sondland was appointed to his position because he was a high $ Trump donor.
Media is complaining because GOP Senators have flat out publicly said they are not interested in allowing witnesses or additional testimony. Ask yourself this? Why do they fear the truth? I would buy if all the info came out and they voted not to remove because they didn't believe it was a crime more than this sham process of trying to keep the truth hidden and from coming to light. And if the truth truly vindicates Trump and clears him, why are they afraid of it? We should never fear truth. We should fear that choose to ignore it or try to cover it up.
And let's just add that a recording just came out with Trump directing someone to get rid of Yovanovitch. But he wasn't telling Pompeo to fire her (which POTUS can do as it has been pointed out that ambassadors serve at the pleasure of the President. He can fire them for being female, gay, black, yellow, whatever. He doesn't need a good reason.) Instead the call sounds like a mob boss calling for someone's elimination. The Ukrainian guys who were buddying up with Giuliani to help with this are revealing all sports of incriminating evidence, that even though it won't be admitted in the Senate trial (see above paragraph about not caring what the truth is), it looks bad and is turning public opinion stronger against Trump and his allies. Wonder how Senators will defend their dereliction of duty to their constituents when the latest Reuters poll shows 71% of Americans believe the impeachment trial should contain witnesses and evidence presented and close to 60% support removing Trump from office. 60% is not a narrow majority either.
Contrast this with Nixon who resigned because he was caught withholding evidence (tapes) from Congress which would clearly led to his impeachment for obstructing justice. Here we have Trump using every possible move to block even more evidence. Openly blocking evidence has now become an acceptable and effective defense.
That precedent is a double edged sword that all sides will suffer from eventually.
That precedent is a double edged sword that all sides will suffer from eventually.
Entirety of the GOP is being held captive by Trump and his mob bosses. Apparently GOP Senators were told that if they crossed Trump during the impeachment trial it would be "their head on a pike".
Whatever happened the truth shall set you free?
The Republican's time to provide defense starts tomorrow or whenever the next session is. We are still in the Democrat's 24 hours. The Rs can't interrupt them. But there will be 24 hours for them to provide "defense." I don't like that concept because one is innocent until proven guilty Schiff talks about "imagining" what it will be like with future presidents. The Senate wasn't sworn to imagine anything. They were sworn to act a jury and determine whether the were high crimes and misdemeanors serious to justify removing a president.
Poll out today by ABC/WP shows 45% want Trump removed from office. I consider that a fairly low number considering the Dems have taken the last two months presenting their case. I would anticipate that number dropping slightly when the Pubs get their opportunity. Without a smoking gun there is zero chance a sitting President gets removed from office with those type of numbers. The fact the vote in the House to impeach was strictly partisan obviously doesn't help those seeking removal. I would expect the vote in the Senate to resemble what we saw in the House
Agreed, but you must understand that the jury has said it won't be impartial. The idiot running the Senate stated as so on national TV. And show me any trial that would allow members of the jury to collude with the accused on how the evidence is presented, withheld, blocked etc. They are not acting as impartial members of a jury (which they signed an oath in full view of public), they are acting out as protectors of a secret. And the Rs tasked with presenting the defense have already stated their case is what he did wasn't a crime.
I would be interested in seeing who they asked. It should be random w/o targeting any party or even registered voters. This is not a question for a likely voter. I bet if you conduct the same poll on Monday it jumps given the new news from today.
I've found the Reuters and Monmouth polls are least likely to be biased in the way questions are asked and thus likely producing the most statistically relevant data. The news outlets and their names have been afflicted by Trump's remarks claiming they are "fake" simply because they don't paint him in a positive light. Their polls suffer from public opinion of the organizations sponsoring the poll and thus you don't always get an accurate response.
Schiff limited everything the Republicans wanted to do.
So far all.ive heard from the testimony is I did not like what he said.
And they have been preparing for this for almost three year's
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