Our President shows his toughness.

lawpoke87

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Clearly Florida is better. Hahaha said no one ever.
Except for the thousands of people leaving California and the thousands of people moving to Florida I suppose. Newsome is the only Governor of California to ever experience a loss of population. Quite the referendum on the state of the state. We’re seeing something in the range of 5-10% of new home sales we’re closing are now California buyers. Wild stuff.
 
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noble cane

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Except for the thousands of people leaving California and the thousands of people moving to Florida I suppose. Newsome is the only Governor of California to ever experience a loss of population. Quite the referendum on the state of the state. We’re seeing something in the range of 5-10% of new home sales we’re closing are now California buyers. Wild stuff.
Even the college football teams are trying to get out of California..
 
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HuffyCane

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Except for the thousands of people leaving California and the thousands of people moving to Florida I suppose. Newsome is the only Governor of California to ever experience a loss of population. Quite the referendum on the state of the state. We’re seeing something in the range of 5-10% of new home sales we’re closing are now California buyers. Wild stuff.
I hear you and agree. But those numbers are raw. Florida saw a net loss in migration as well for the first time in decades last year. More people are moving there than ever before. But more people are leaving because it’s now unaffordable.
 

GoldenCaneKC

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Clearly Florida is better. Hahaha said no one ever.
Are you truly unaware of the mass migration taking place out of states like CA, NY, and IL and into states like TX, FL, and NC? Or just trolling?

Except for the thousands of people leaving California and the thousands of people moving to Florida I suppose.
More like “hundreds of thousands”…and it’s not going to stop anytime soon.

Florida saw a net loss in migration as well for the first time in decades last year.
Source? I haven’t seen a single source that says Florida’s pop declined last year. Or can you clarify what metric you’re referring to?
 

astonmartin708

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Are you truly unaware of the mass migration taking place out of states like CA, NY, and IL and into states like TX, FL, and NC? Or just trolling?


More like “hundreds of thousands”…and it’s not going to stop anytime soon.


Source? I haven’t seen a single source that says Florida’s pop declined last year. Or can you clarify what metric you’re referring to?
Covid restrictions really riled a bunch of Republicans feathers and they ran home crying. No state taxes is also a cute benefit until you realize that the states either offer far fewer social benefits to their citizens or they recover the money in variety of other manners targeted at the poor and middle class.

Don't be surprised when abortion restrictions have the opposite effect. They're already saying it's effecting college admissions in red states.
 
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lawpoke87

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Covid restrictions really riled a bunch of Republicans feathers and they ran home crying. No state taxes is also a cute benefit until you realize that the states either offer far fewer social benefits to their citizens or they recover the money in variety of other manners targeted at the poor and middle class.

Don't be surprised when abortion restrictions have the opposite effect. They're already saying it's effecting college admissions in red states.
Article addressing why people are leaving California. Covid restrictions aren’t listed btw. What is listed are numerous social problems. Appears those social benefits California’s are paying those high taxes for aren’t exactly working.

Homeless
California 161k
Florida 27k

California getting the most out of those high taxes

 
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aTUfan

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la la land
Covid restrictions really riled a bunch of Republicans feathers and they ran home crying. No state taxes is also a cute benefit until you realize that the states either offer far fewer social benefits to their citizens or they recover the money in variety of other manners targeted at the poor and middle class.

Don't be surprised when abortion restrictions have the opposite effect. They're already saying it's effecting college admissions in red states.
what social services dont they get.
 

URedskin54

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Covid restrictions really riled a bunch of Republicans feathers and they ran home crying. No state taxes is also a cute benefit until you realize that the states either offer far fewer social benefits to their citizens or they recover the money in variety of other manners targeted at the poor and middle class.

Not sure about Florida, but Texas does the opposite and hammers upper / upper middle class with property tax for revenue.
 

astonmartin708

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Article addressing why people are leaving California. Covid restrictions aren’t listed btw. What is listed are numerous social problems. Appears those social benefits California’s are paying those high taxes for aren’t exactly working.

Homeless
California 161k
Florida 27k

California getting the most out of those high taxes

What is surprising to you that people without homes tend to want to go to a place where the climate isn't terrible for half the year? Who the hell wants to live outside in 110 degree heat? Same goes for rainfall... if you're living outside, do you want to live in the place where it rains a bunch or where it rains a little? Do you want to have to live outside through hurricanes?

People are saying that the crappier climate in Texas is worth the lower cost of living... until they realize that ERCOT sucks and they have no AC in the summer and no heat in the winter. You would have to pay me a hell of a lot to move to Texas ever. Oklahoma's climate sucked enough for a lifetime.

As for Florida, it certainly has a better climate and is more attractive, but it's still imperfect and physically or in terms of government, it's not superior to Cali. There is a reason that the 'Florida Man' gets made fun of perpetually.
 
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lawpoke87

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What is surprising to you that people without homes tend to want to go to a place where the climate isn't terrible for half the year? Who the hell wants to live outside in 110 degree heat? Same goes for rainfall... if you're living outside, do you want to live in the place where it rains a bunch or where it rains a little? Do you want to have to live outside through hurricanes?

People are saying that the crappier climate in Texas is worth the lower cost of living... until they realize that ERCOT sucks and they have no AC in the summer and no heat in the winter. You would have to pay me a hell of a lot to move to Texas ever. Oklahoma's climate sucked enough for a lifetime.

As for Florida, it certainly has a better climate and is more attractive, but it's still imperfect and physically or in terms of government, it's not superior to Cali. There is a reason that the 'Florida Man' gets made fun of perpetually.
Aston…where did you miss that this has never happened in California. The homeless crisis and expensive housing isn’t new. People moving out of state by the hundreds of thousands is though. Just extraordinary and shows the state of the government and social conditions there. California has become a disaster


Texas has added over 4M people in the last ten years. Tops in the country. People aren’t moving out.

Florida has added over 3M people since 2010 and has seen growth every year. Second in the country only to Texas. People aren’t moving out of Florida either. Contrast again to people fleeing California due to the states social and economic issues for the working class

Hilarious you’re talking about Texas power grid btw

 
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lawpoke87

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You are quoting out dated figures. From 2020-2021. The latest figures are upside down.

Paywall. Do you have a direct link to the data ?

Latest I found

 

HuffyCane

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Paywall. Do you have a direct link to the data ?

Latest I found
My statements are also made based on the budget estimating conference of Florida state government. I’ll see if I can get a link to the legislative analysis. Florida is also tackling a property insurance crisis that necessitated a special session of the Legislature. You can expect to pay three to four times the national average in insurance coverage. It’s a great place to live. Y’all should come on down. But it’s not paradise and property values are beginning to drop. And don’t expect the old people to pay for your schools either.

 

drboobay

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All this fancy economic talk but bottom line - Florida is too humid. I don't like sweating. Neither does my family.

So we pick San Diego every time.
 

HuffyCane

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Not sure about Florida, but Texas does the opposite and hammers upper / upper middle class with property tax for revenue.
Florida has property taxes below the national average in most counties if you reside here 183 days a year or more and do not rent the property more than 61 days a year.

Florida’s sales and gasoline taxes are well above average in order to tax the tourists. There is no personal income tax. Corporate taxes are about 5% but only for certain industries. Florida derives substantial income from documentary stamp collection. Grandma dies and we collect when you sell the condo. Finally, Florida state taxes are low due to Florida ranking near the bottom in state worker pay and the number of state workers per capita. Under the bold leadership of Jeb Bush, Florida modernized state government and reformed pension and collective bargaining agreements. That continues to pay dividends today. In Oklahoma, you continue to finance gridlock, outdated systems, and an upside down pension fund.
 

lawpoke87

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Not surprised with property insurance issues down there given the constant threat of hurricanes. I’m with drboobay….the humidity is a no go for me. Looking at our weather forecast over the next 2-3 weeks, Tulsa is going to be a no go for me as well.
 
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HuffyCane

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Not surprised with property insurance issues down there given the constant threat of hurricanes. I’m with drboobay….the humidity is a no go for me. Looking at our weather forecast over the next 2-3 weeks, Tulsa is going to be a no go for me as well.
There’s a reason half the state of North Carolina is Florida retirees.
 

HuffyCane

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Not surprised with property insurance issues down there given the constant threat of hurricanes. I’m with drboobay….the humidity is a no go for me. Looking at our weather forecast over the next 2-3 weeks, Tulsa is going to be a no go for me as well.
It has more to do with outside insurance companies coming into the state to exploit the migration and they lack the funds to pay out claims. I’m not an expert on the stuff but it’s a symptom of the growth frenzy from New York I’m told reliably.
 

drboobay

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There’s a reason half the state of North Carolina is Florida retirees.
Yep we keep trying. People say things like "this and this is so great" or "we love Seaside." Blah blah blah.

Then we all pack up, head to our condo, and look at one another and say "it is so hot and sticky, why did we come here?"

Pretty much in full agreement after the last time - never again waste a vacation there. And retirement? At least we have 7 or 8 months a year in Tulsa without the miserable heat and humidity. If I can't afford San Diego I'd much rather just stay here.

Coronado or bust.
 
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HuffyCane

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Yep we keep trying. People say things like "this and this is so great" or "we love Seaside." Blah blah blah.

Then we all pack up, head to our condo, and look at one another and say "it is so hot and sticky, why did we come here?"

Pretty much in full agreement after the last time - never again waste a vacation there. And retirement? At least we have 7 or 8 months a year in Tulsa without the miserable heat and humidity. If I can't afford San Diego I'd much rather just stay here.

Coronado or bust.
Florida weather has never been a plus. It’s marketing. The Sunshine State? Seattle has more average days of Sunshine. Once upon a time it’s best marketing was “the weather is better than New York and it’s not New York and the traffic.” Well, the weather is still a struggle four months a year but now every major city is a suburb of New York with millennials commuting by plane to dodge taxes and gridlocked. Still, I’d rather be indoors 4 months a year in summer than 9 months a year in winter.
 

drboobay

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I guess everyone must pick their poison.

I don't mind cold weather a bit and would take 32 degrees over 100 all day long. 70 is perfection. 60 or even 50 pretty nice. You can always wear a sweatshirt and be perfectly comfy.

85 is too hot with any humidity at all.

Yes I know I digress but have always found the popularity of Florida baffling.

Back to Joe Biden I guess. Not the worst President ever. There are plusses to "mostly ineffectual."
 
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astonmartin708

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Aston…where did you miss that this has never happened in California. The homeless crisis and expensive housing isn’t new. People moving out of state by the hundreds of thousands is though. Just extraordinary and shows the state of the government and social conditions there. California has become a disaster


Texas has added over 4M people in the last ten years. Tops in the country. People aren’t moving out.

Florida has added over 3M people since 2010 and has seen growth every year. Second in the country only to Texas. People aren’t moving out of Florida either. Contrast again to people fleeing California due to the states social and economic issues for the working class

Hilarious you’re talking about Texas power grid btw

Again, you are looking at numbers that have only come around since Covid. sounds like you should move to Texas. Enjoy the land of sweat.
 

astonmartin708

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Florida weather has never been a plus. It’s marketing. The Sunshine State? Seattle has more average days of Sunshine. Once upon a time it’s best marketing was “the weather is better than New York and it’s not New York and the traffic.” Well, the weather is still a struggle four months a year but now every major city is a suburb of New York with millennials commuting by plane to dodge taxes and gridlocked. Still, I’d rather be indoors 4 months a year in summer than 9 months a year in winter.
I can put on a coat and go snowshoeing and be warm. I can only take off so many clothes to go outside And not feel like I’m dying.
 
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lawpoke87

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Again, you are looking at numbers that have only come around since Covid. sounds like you should move to Texas. Enjoy the land of sweat.
Covid has been around for ten years? Texas and Florida have added over 7M people over that time period. I’m not a huge fan of either state btw. However, I do realize people are fleeing California in record numbers despite an ideal climate. That state government has certainly failed at something.

I did just see where LA is starting their mask mandate again. Nevermind we now have overwhelming evidence such mandates are ineffective in slowing the spread of covid. Just madness.
 
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astonmartin708

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Covid has been around for ten years? Texas and Florida have added over 7M people over that time period. I’m not a huge fan of either state btw. However, I do realize people are fleeing California in record numbers despite an ideal climate. That state government has certainly failed at something.

I did just see where LA is starting their mask mandate again. Nevermind we now have overwhelming evidence such mandates are ineffective in slowing the spread of covid. Just madness.
I think the difference here is: are people moving to texas because they inherently want to move to Texas, or are they moving to Texas because it’s cheap and that’s their best available option? Having a low cost of living is a good thing, but the low cost of living is also tied to the fact that few people actually want to stay in Texas when all options are equal monetarily. If you could have the same cost of living and quality of life Texas vs Hawaii… who in their right mind chooses Texas?
 

URedskin54

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The weather in Texas is god awful all the time. Houston, which people keep flocking to, is easily my least favorite city in the whole country. Weather, traffic, terrible beaches. I enjoyed my time in Austin, but that was 3 years ago when we could afford it. Now any normal person has to either rent a tiny apartment for the cost of a mortgage or live out past Georgetown. Jobs are jobs but I have a hard time seeing the appeal of moving to Texas beyond that. It’s the only reason we’re here…..for now.
 
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watu05

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I think the difference here is: are people moving to texas because they inherently want to move to Texas, or are they moving to Texas because it’s cheap and that’s their best available option? Having a low cost of living is a good thing, but the low cost of living is also tied to the fact that few people actually want to stay in Texas when all options are equal monetarily. If you could have the same cost of living and quality of life Texas vs Hawaii… who in their right mind chooses Texas?
I know former Tulsans who retired to Texas because they preferred a conservative political climate, year round golf, and lower cost of living to the Pacific Northwest. Others I've talked to prefer the political climate in Texas enough that it offsets what some might think of as negatives. For these folks, it seems an excellent and rational fit. Also they don't have grand-kids and have mostly lost their ties to Tulsa.
 

astonmartin708

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I know former Tulsans who retired to Texas because they preferred a conservative political climate, year round golf, and lower cost of living to the Pacific Northwest. Others I've talked to prefer the political climate in Texas enough that it offsets what some might think of as negatives. For these folks, it seems an excellent and rational fit. Also they don't have grand-kids and have mostly lost their ties to Tulsa.
If they had the sense to not settle for living in a sweltering sweat pool maybe they could have afforded to live in the PNW or Cali in the first place where they have year round golf and semi decent climates . Hahaha

I say good riddance. If all of the conservatives want to centralize into Texas and leave the good climates for me, they can be my guest.

I understand old folks moving from the snow in NY down to the gulf coast, but anyone who actually likes to go outside their home on a regular basis should avoid Florida or TX.
 

lawpoke87

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If they had the sense to not settle for living in a sweltering sweat pool maybe they could have afforded to live in the PNW or Cali in the first place where they have year round golf and semi decent climates . Hahaha

I say good riddance. If all of the conservatives want to centralize into Texas and leave the good climates for me, they can be my guest.

I understand old folks moving from the snow in NY down to the gulf coast, but anyone who actually likes to go outside their home on a regular basis should avoid Florida or TX.
Yet they’re the two fastest growing states in the country. Go figure.
 

drboobay

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Yet they’re the two fastest growing states in the country. Go figure.
Not for me but whatever. People like what they like. All things considered I like Tulsa and will probably stay here.
 

lawpoke87

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Not for me but whatever. People like what they like. All things considered I like Tulsa and will probably stay here.
I call Tulsa my home as well and have chosen to raise my family here and probably will die here. I reserve the right to change my mind after this summer btw 🔥🔥. I’ve always had a soft spot for the Colorado and New Mexico mountains. Beautiful country and not near as cold as most people believe once you get below 7000 feet.
 

drboobay

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I call Tulsa my home as well and have chosen to raise my family here and probably will die here. I reserve the right to change my mind after this summer btw 🔥🔥. I’ve always had a soft spot for the Colorado and New Mexico mountains. Beautiful country and not near as cold as most people believe once you get below 7000 feet.
Ideal world I could afford a second home in a preferred vacation spot. Who knows? Could happen...
 

noble cane

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Ideal world I could afford a second home in a preferred vacation spot. Who knows? Could happen...
A party should make that a part of their platform... summer homes in the mountains and winter homes by the beach for all...
 

lawpoke87

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Help me out here. Saudi increases its oil imports from Russia so Saudi can turn around and export more oil to those countries who have sanctions against importing Russian crude ?


 

astonmartin708

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Help me out here. Saudi increases its oil imports from Russia so Saudi can turn around and export more oil to those countries who have sanctions against importing Russian crude ?


A) Saudi sucks, and they only do what's best for Saudi.
B) I predicted this in February. Still have two lunch bets at work that WTI crude wouldn't close above $125 this year. So far we've hit $124 and $122 and now we're falling again. I made these bets based on the presumption that after the Ukrainian invasion, supply relationships would shift around the world, but the net oil supply of the world wouldn't fall of drastically. People would just change who they're buying from.
 

astonmartin708

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Yet they’re the two fastest growing states in the country. Go figure.
On a related note:

Texas was just ranked by CNBC as the number 2 worst state to live in; Oklahoma coming just behind at number 3.


https://www.cnbc.com/2022/07/14/these-10-states-are-americas-worst-places-to-live-in-2022.html

US News does Have Texas slightly better off at 31. Florida does well at 10, but I tend to disagree with the US News evaluation that Florida has one of the best qualities of education, considering their recent foray into refusing to teach students about cultural issues, sexual issues, etc...
 
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lawpoke87

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A) Saudi sucks, and they only do what's best for Saudi.
B) I predicted this in February. Still have two lunch bets at work that WTI crude wouldn't close above $125 this year. So far we've hit $124 and $122 and now we're falling again. I made these bets based on the presumption that after the Ukrainian invasion, supply relationships would shift around the world, but the net oil supply of the world wouldn't fall of drastically. People would just change who they're buying from.
Recession fears are certainly helping your wager as well. Your friends should go ahead and buy those lunches.
 

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