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No comments on Woodward's new book?...

noble cane

I.T.S. University President
Feb 25, 2002
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I would have thought that Millie's admitted potential coup d'etat would have generated some talk...
 
He took an oath to protect the constitution, which Donald Trump directed a violent mob to attack on, on Jan 6. Seems pretty cut and dry to me.
 
Figured that would be your take. He also swore to obey the orders of the president. Conspiring with the enemy is not really in those parameters. There is the 25th amendment if he has a problem. Take the stars off your collar and find a TV camera.

If he did the same for Biden or Obama would you feel the same?

If he acted to attack a perceived threat without orders?

Theres a chain of command. Like it or not.

But, he made "perfect" calls.

I'm not arguing whether Trump was unhinged. I am arguing that we have civilian control of the military for a reason. That reason is to keep commanders from acting unilaterally.

If its true that he consulted with Pelosi and company then thats essentially a coup and thats a bigger danger to our republic than the illiterate idiots that stormed the capitol on 1/6. Whether you want to face it or not, we are not a bananna republic that can be overthrown by seizing the palace.
 
Figured that would be your take. He also swore to obey the orders of the president. Conspiring with the enemy is not really in those parameters. There is the 25th amendment if he has a problem. Take the stars off your collar and find a TV camera.

If he did the same for Biden or Obama would you feel the same?

If he acted to attack a perceived threat without orders?

Theres a chain of command. Like it or not.

But, he made "perfect" calls.

I'm not arguing whether Trump was unhinged. I am arguing that we have civilian control of the military for a reason. That reason is to keep commanders from acting unilaterally.

If its true that he consulted with Pelosi and company then thats essentially a coup and thats a bigger danger to our republic than the illiterate idiots that stormed the capitol on 1/6. Whether you want to face it or not, we are not a bananna republic that can be overthrown by seizing the palace.
If Biden or Obama had done what Trump did in January, I would have been fine with their generals doing the same. It was treasonous and the only reason he wasn’t convicted of such was because of partisan politics.

In my opinion as soon as you intentionally incite or commit a violent act meant to disturb the lawful processes agreed to in the constitution, then your position of power should be considered null and void. Post Jan. 6th we didn’t have a President. We had a criminal in a high castle who was spared by his corrupt cronies.

Acting as though the more significant danger in the situation was the person acting to actually preserve our republic rather than the one trying to overthrow it via a violent mob is simply insane.

It’s very nice to know that we have someone with the character of Milley in that position. I would personally vote for him for President if he ran.
 
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I know facts are a troublesome thing

The FBI can find whatever it wants. I watched the man on live TV tell his crowd to March on the Capitol in order to disturb a constitutionally mandated election process through a show of “strength”. I don’t care if Trump or his admin didn’t get all of the rioters parking passes. His actions and the actions of of his immediate staff, family, and friends were more than enough to be considered treason considering what has been on the past.
 
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The only, and I mean ONLY, thing that prevented him from being convicted were a group of 43 corrupt Republican Senators, and the argument that he had already left office by the time the trial started. In fact Milley, in his action sided with a 57% majority. Which probably represented somewhere around 60+ million more people than the minority side did. (Based on the representation of the voting Senators)
 
The FBI can find whatever it wants. I watched the man on live TV tell his crowd to March on the Capitol in order to disturb a constitutionally mandated election process through a show of “strength”. I don’t care if Trump or his admin didn’t get all of the rioters parking passes. His actions and the actions of of his immediate staff, family, and friends were more than enough to be considered treason considering what has been on the past.
Yeah….screw the FBI and their 6 month investigation with interviews, etc.. What do they know. Investigating matters is only what they do. Lol. Quite the indictment on Milley’s unconstitutional actions. Court martial.
 
Yeah….screw the FBI and their 6 month investigation with interviews, etc.. What do they know. Investigating matters is only what they do. Lol. Quite the indictment on Milley’s unconstitutional actions. Court martial.
The question wasn’t whether he organized the violence, it’s whether he used his stage to incite it. That is not what the FBI was asking about. Ignoring one act of treason and accusing another. Classic Conservative.

“All enemies, foreign and domestic.” Guess who the domestic enemies were on January 6th? It wasn’t Mark Milley trying to prevent a treasonous madman from starting a war.

Would you have supported a court martial for Claus Von Stoffenberg for Operation Valkyrie and trying to stop Hitler too?
 
The question wasn’t whether he organized the violence, it’s whether he used his stage to incite it. That is not what the FBI was asking about. Ignoring one act of treason and accusing another. Classic Conservative.

“All enemies, foreign and domestic.” Guess who the domestic enemies were on January 6th? It wasn’t Mark Milley trying to prevent a treasonous madman from starting a war.
1). No evidence Trump was involved in organizing violence
2). No evidence of an organized plot to overthrow election.

These are the FBI findings verbatim. As such, Milley has no business wearing the uniform as he directly attempted to violate the constitution.
 
1). No evidence Trump was involved in organizing violence
2). No evidence of an organized plot to overthrow election.

These are the FBI findings verbatim. As such, Milley has no business wearing the uniform as he directly attempted to violate the constitution.
He didn’t need to ORGANIZE the violence to commit a treasonous act. All he needed to do was take advantage of an already assembled crowd. Which he did.

Again… the question of treason isn’t if he directed subordinates to post on Facebook that the people should come (which is the kind of what the FBI was looking for). It is did he invite a mob of his gathered supporters to disrupt a constitutional process… which he did. No different than if they gathered outside his house with torches and pitchforks and he told them to go show the Democrats who was boss.

I honestly don’t know how you can even argue any differently. It was on live national television. This wasn’t a back room watergate tape. This was him directing an action in real time. No different than a Mob Boss telling a group of thugs that he doesn’t want to see a rival for a long time… and them taking that implicitly to mean that they should kill him and throw him in the river.
 
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He didn’t need to ORGANIZE the violence to commit a treasonous act. All he needed to do was take advantage of an already assembled crowd. Which he did.

Again… the question of treason isn’t if he directed subordinates to post on Facebook that the people should come (which is the kind of what the FBI was looking for). It is did he invite a mob of his gathered supporters to disrupt a constitutional process… which he did. No different than if they gathered outside his house with torches and pitchforks and he told them to go show the Democrats who was boss.

I honestly don’t know how you can even argue any differently. It was on live national television. This wasn’t a back room watergate tape. This was him directing an action in real time. No different than a Mob Boss telling a group of thugs that he doesn’t want to see a rival for a long time… and them taking that implicitly to mean that they should kill him and throw him in the river.
If there were no organized plot to disrupt the constitutional process…which is now fact. Your entire argument is invalid and not supported by the findings of the FBI.

Again….based on the findings of no organized plot of disrupt the constitutional process, Milley needs to face a court martial. The only organized plot to subvert the constitution was by him…and that is a fact
 
If there were no organized plot to disrupt the constitutional process…which is now fact. Your entire argument is invalid and not supported by the findings of the FBI.
My entire argument was supported by a significant majority of jurists in the president’s trial. (And an even more significant portion of Americans who were witnesses to the event) If 3% more of the jurists had agreed with me would you admit that your argument is complete horse :crap:?

It must be nice to be put on trial for the attempted murder of a Republic and to have 4/10 of the jurors to be your pals from work.
 
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If Biden or Obama had done what Trump did in January, I would have been fine with their generals doing the same. It was treasonous and the only reason he wasn’t convicted of such was because of partisan politics.

In my opinion as soon as you intentionally incite or commit a violent act meant to disturb the lawful processes agreed to in the constitution, then your position of power should be considered null and void. Post Jan. 6th we didn’t have a President. We had a criminal in a high castle who was spared by his corrupt cronies.

Acting as though the more significant danger in the situation was the person acting to actually preserve our republic rather than the one trying to overthrow it via a violent mob is simply insane.

It’s very nice to know that we have someone with the character of Milley in that position. I would personally vote for him for President if he ran.
So.. lets throw a jan 6 moment out..

What if Millie decides that Obama or Biden is incompetent to run the military.. are you ok with his actions then..

Biden is a senile fool.. so Millie decides that an order from him is not valid and does this in consult with McConnell.. still ok?
 
My entire argument was supported by a significant majority of jurists in the president’s trial. (And an even more significant portion of Americans who were witnesses to the event) If 3% more of the jurists had agreed with me would you admit that your argument is complete horse :crap:?

It must be nice to be put on trial for the attempted murder of a Republic and to have 4/10 of the jurors to be your pals from work.
…but not the FBI who did an extensive investigation into the matter. The one impartial body who task is to investigate matters such as this. Gotcha. I’m not going to dismiss the findings of the FBI because it doesn’t fit my political narrative. This matter doesn’t even make it to a trial based on those findings btw. As I said above, the only actor here proven to have attempted to obstruct our democratic process is Milley. Ironically, the guy you would vote for President :)

The fact that a majority of jurists would not follow the findings of the FBI show me which jurists are in the wrong based on partisanship and which ones were in the right.
 
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Curious.. are you saying that the military should have acted and assassinated a president?
I’m saying that appropriate measures to prevent a person from becoming or continuing to act as a despot need to be taken. Killing Hitler was probably the only way that Hitler’s hold on power in Germany would have ended.

On the contrary the relegation of rights of the office of the president, when the president has violated his oath of office in front of all of America in an egregious and violent manner, could necessitate extraordinary action from military leaders. That does not mean killing Trump. But it might mean keeping him away from the ability necessary to hold power. Remember that even after his attempted violent coup on Jan. 6th no one was sure he would willingly vacate the office.
 
…but not the FBI who did an extensive investigation into the matter. The one impartial body who task is to investigate matters such as this. Gotcha. I’m not going to dismiss the findings of the FBI because it doesn’t fit my political narrative. This matter doesn’t even make it to a trial based on those findings btw. As I said above, the only actor here proven to have attempted to obstruct our democratic process is Milley. Ironically, the guy you would vote for President :)

The fact that a majority of jurists would not follow the findings of the FBI show me which jurists are in the wrong based on partisanship and which ones were in the right.
I repeat, THE FBI WAS NOT EXAMINING IF TRUMP COMMITTED A TREASONOUS ACT. THEY WERE EXAMINING IF HE DIRECTLY ORGANIZED A RALLY FULL OF TREASONOUS PEOPLE THAT LED TO A TREASONOUS ACT. THE FBI WAS LOOKING FOR COORDINATION PRIOR TO JAN 6th.

Partisan politicking is anyone who didn’t vote to convict on such cut and dry evidence.

You keep ignoring the fact that an authority figure who is standing and addressing an angry mob has responsibility for the directives that they give the angry mob. It doesn’t matter how or why the mob got to the point that they were listening to the speaker. It doesn’t matter if the speaker did or didn’t have a hand in organizing them to be there. If the speaker invites violence then they are culpable. Imagine if an Ohio State QB got on a microphone after a contentious loss to Michigan and told his fans to go show how strong Ohio State really is outside the stadium. If a bunch of Michigan fans were beaten and trampled, would the speaker not be at fault for encouraging an action that wouldn’t have taken place otherwise? Words can have consequences.

If Biden or Obama did the same thing, then they should be removed. Imagine if Biden told a crowd that they should go show a trump rally who’s boss.
 
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Striking is that even key. senior Trump appointees feared he was crazy enough to start a war to stay in office. Pence and the country were lucky he listened to Dan Quayle. If he hadn't, the January 6 outcome could have been far different.
 
I’m saying that appropriate measures to prevent a person from becoming or continuing to act as a despot need to be taken. Killing Hitler was probably the only way that Hitler’s hold on power in Germany would have ended.

On the contrary the relegation of rights of the office of the president, when the president has violated his oath of office in front of all of America in an egregious and violent manner, could necessitate extraordinary action from military leaders. That does not mean killing Trump. But it might mean keeping him away from the ability necessary to hold power. Remember that even after his attempted violent coup on Jan. 6th no one was sure he would willingly vacate the office.
Man.. you sound like a bananna republic general that is just relieving "el presidente" in order to save the country..

I fear for our republic if a bunch of unarmed rioters in a mostly peaceful protest can bring it down.
 
Oh I repeat, THE FBI WAS NOT EXAMINING IF TRUMP COMMITTED A TREASONOUS ACT. THEY WERE EXAMINING IF HE DIRECTLY ORGANIZED A RALLY FULL OF TREASONOUS PEOPLE THAT LED TO A TREASONOUS ACT. THE FBI WAS LOOKING FOR COORDINATION PRIOR TO JAN 6th.

Partisan politicking is anyone who didn’t vote to convict on such cut and dry evidence.

You keep ignoring the fact that an authority figure who is standing and addressing an angry mob has responsibility for the directives that they give the angry mob. It doesn’t matter how or why the mob got to the point that they were listening to the speaker. It doesn’t matter if the speaker did or didn’t have a hand in organizing them to be there. If the speaker invites violence then they are culpable. Imagine if an Ohio State QB got on a microphone after a contentious loss to Michigan and told his fans to go show how strong Ohio State really is outside the stadium.
Again....

1). No evidence Trump was involved in organizing violence
2). No evidence of an organized plot to overthrow election.

No evidence is no evidence. No involvement in organizing violence and no evidence of an organized plan to subvert democracy (ie....treasonous act). IN FACT, NOT A SINGLE PERSON HAS EVER BEEN CHARGED WITH INSURRECTION OR SEDITION. Not sure how this could be more clear. The only organized treasonous act here was that of Milley subverting our constitution. Your Presidential candidate of choice apparently :) When you find someone convicted (hell...even charged) with insurrection or sedition let me know.
 
Striking is that even key. senior Trump appointees feared he was crazy enough to start a war to stay in office. Pence and the country were lucky he listened to Dan Quayle. If he hadn't, the January 6 outcome could have been far different.
Then why didnt they invoke the 25th amendment? Surely if the cabinet and the vp agreed that it was necessary then getting it done would have been in the best interests of the country.

Surely you as a vet can understand chain of command. Or, did you frag your Lt.?
 
Man.. you sound like a bananna republic general that is just relieving "el presidente" in order to save the country..

I fear for our republic if a bunch of unarmed rioters in a mostly peaceful protest can bring it down.
They weren’t unarmed. Many were armed with blunt weapons. Moreover, they weren’t just rioting on any random day in a random place. They were trying to capture and or intimidate our elected representatives to change the results of a fair election. If you didn’t notice, it doesn’t take much to overthrow a government. All Hitler had to do was ultimately facilitate a bit of arson. A bunch of unarmed women (with the assistance of some city police) overthrew the Czarist regime in Russia while most of the men were at the front in WWI.

Milley didn’t assume some dictatorial power for himself. He just insured that the will of the people was maintained because the last President refused to do so.
 
Again....

1). No evidence Trump was involved in organizing violence
2). No evidence of an organized plot to overthrow election.

No evidence is no evidence. No involvement in organizing violence and no evidence of an organized plan to subvert democracy (ie....treasonous act). IN FACT, NOT A SINGLE PERSON HAS EVER BEEN CHARGED WITH INSURRECTION OR SEDITION. Not sure how this could be more clear. The only organized treasonous act here was that of Milley subverting our constitution. Your Presidential candidate of choice apparently :) When you find someone convicted (hell...even charged) with insurrection or sedition let me know.
“No evidence that my client, Mr. Capone, was ever involved in any murder” You are either naive or willingly blind. Either way people who refuse to acknowledge that their Messiah could have actually been attempting to subvert democracy are honestly ruining the country. It’s to the point that I’m honestly considering buying property in another country so I can retire elsewhere.

One person tries to insure a peaceful transition of power and you fault him for it while the other literally directs an attack on the republic on live TV and you point to a report that says he didn’t hand out orange slices to all his admirers before telling them to go bash skulls so he’s exculpated. Go jump off a bridge.
 
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Then why didnt they invoke the 25th amendment? Surely if the cabinet and the vp agreed that it was necessary then getting it done would have been in the best interests of the country.

Surely you as a vet can understand chain of command. Or, did you frag your Lt.?
Chain of command only works when your officer is giving lawful commands, or when he isn’t refusing to give commands that would protect the constitution. (Like not ordering the military to put down an armed rebellion on our Capitol during a constitutionally mandated event for 6 hours)

Also, if you’ve ever read the constitution, that’s not the intent of the 25th amendment. As we know it was passed to allow presidents who are literally incapacitated or lack the mental facility to serve to be removed from office. Clearly Trump knew what he was doing. His only madness was vanity and selfishness. He wasn’t legally insane or excessively senile.
 
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Not everything bad is treason lol. Trump did several things that inflamed things and got supporters to believe complete lies. Without him doing that the Capitol riot doesn’t happen. To me that’s more than enough to impeach a president, but treason? Nah
 
“No evidence that my client, Mr. Capone, was ever involved in any murder” You are either naive or willingly blind. Either way people who refuse to acknowledge that their Messiah could have actually been attempting to subvert democracy are honestly ruining the country. It’s to the point that I’m honestly considering buying property in another country so I can retire elsewhere.

One person tries to insure a peaceful transition of power and you fault him for it while the other literally directs an attack on the republic on live TV and you point to a report that says he didn’t hand out orange slices to all his admirers before telling them to go bash skulls so he’s exculpated. Go jump off a bridge.
I reference the official report not just a report. A report made after hours and hours of investigation. I also reference that not a single person has even been charged with treasonous actions. My comments aren't meant as a defense of Trump but as an indictment of a General who attempted to subvert our democratic process based on an incident where no treasonous charges were ever filed. Milley was absolutely wrong and should face the consequences. He knows the chain of command and chose to break the same.
 
I reference the official report not just a report. A report made after hours and hours of investigation. I also reference that not a single person has even been charged with treasonous actions. My comments aren't meant as a defense of Trump but as an indictment of a General who attempted to subvert our democratic process based on an incident where no treasonous charges were ever filed. Milley was absolutely wrong and should face the consequences. He knows the chain of command and chose to break the same.
I want you to go back and read the history of people in the US who were actually convicted of treason. While many were granted clemency by the likes of Adams and Washington, what they did in terms of actual violence was much more innocuous than the actions we saw in January 6th and they were all similar in their assault on the constitution. Just because the charges haven’t been levied does not mean they weren’t warranted. It could be a directive from Biden to try and defuse the situation, especially since Trump garnered such blind and vociferous support abroad who are clearly unable to recognize right from wrong and would likely take the treason conviction of the Jan 6th rioters as a further call to arms.
 
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Zero chance Biden is giving Trump supporters any type of break. Never has and never will. I’ll stick to the facts. Zero evidence of any organized plan to subvert the democratic process and not a single person convicted or even charged with treasonous acts. Again…Based on the findings of the FBI and the charges brought forth by the justice dept, Milley should immediately be court marshaled for his assault on the constitution.
 
Speaking of our next President Milley. Here is is referring to the strike which killed an aid worker and his seven children as “righteous”.


 
Zero chance Biden is giving Trump supporters any type of break. Never has and never will. I’ll stick to the facts. Zero evidence of any organized plan to subvert the democratic process and not a single person convicted or even charged with treasonous acts. Again…Based on the findings of the FBI and the charges brought forth by the justice dept, Milley should immediately be court marshaled for his assault on the constitution.
The facts your pointing to don’t prove the hypotheses that you’re championing.
 
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